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Wait and see with Cardinals and FA CB

Posted by Darren Urban on March 16, 2017 – 3:22 pm

Brandon Carr went to the Ravens Thursday and Morris Claiborne to the Jets and the free-agent cornerback pool got a little smaller. But at this point, I’m not sure it makes a big difference to the Cardinals. Yes, with the defection of Marcus Cooper to the Bears, the Cardinals are going to have to find a new starter opposite Patrick Peterson. But it looks like that will be a slowly developing situation rather than an immediate fix.

There remain in-house candidates like Justin Bethel and Brandon Williams. Bethel did just take a paycut as he tries to rehab his cornerback stock (he did play well at the nickel late in the season and Bruce Arians noted that Bethel’s best spot was probably in the slot), while Williams struggled a lot as the raw, young cornerback that he is and he is far from a sure thing as a starter in this league.

But in a draft deep in cornerback talent, choosing one in the early rounds looks like the initial play. There are a few “name” cornerbacks still out there in free agency — Alterraun Verner, Brandon Flowers, and yes, Darrelle Revis, for example — but there is a reason they are still on the market. (No, I don’t see any chance Revis would be a pickup, regardless.)

This seems headed for the same place it was last season, where Bethel and now Williams and a draft pick will get a chance to show what they have, and a veteran will be picked up at some point to be in the mix. Remember, the Cardinals added Mike Jenkins and Alan Ball in camp last year before injuries took them out (Jenkins was your starter before he hurt his knee) and the team traded for Cooper.


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44 Responses to “Wait and see with Cardinals and FA CB”

  1. By Wild Blue Yonder on Mar 16, 2017 | Reply

    Darren,

    How much did Brandon Carr and Morris Claiborne receive?

  2. By Darren Urban on Mar 16, 2017 | Reply

    Wild Blue —

    RE: Contracts

    I don’t know.

  3. By mitchaz on Mar 16, 2017 | Reply

    The vast majority of this off-season feels like “wait and wait.”

    Don’t know how anyone can spin it otherwise.

  4. By Eric G on Mar 16, 2017 | Reply

    I want to hear Terrance Newman, Darius Butler, Nickell Robey-Coleman, Deshawn Shead, Brandon Flowers, Alterraun Verner OR Sterling Moore were signed before the draft. Possible Leon Hall as an option too. Any one of those would be an upgrade over Bethel and Williams.

  5. By Smity72 on Mar 16, 2017 | Reply

    I think this is absolutely ridiculous. Keim promised that they would be aggressive in free agency, and the only thing they have done once again is sign guys who are over the hill. They should have signed Carr or Claiborne. And they gave to much money to Jones. This front office is way worse than when Graves was there. They should have let Palmer go and brought in Romo. To think that Bethel and Williams will be our corner, that’s a joke. This is the reason this team has the longest streak of any of being winless.

  6. By NJAzCardsFan on Mar 16, 2017 | Reply

    How many plays not games with the Cards O- line would Romo last…???
    I’ll take Palmer over Romo any time.
    This has to be the most boring Cards FA period that I can remember….!!!!
    This doesn’t give me much confidence with the up coming season
    Wake me up when it is over…..!!!!

  7. By Kevin shuck on Mar 16, 2017 | Reply

    Why not take a one year shot at Revis acrossed from Peterson? We brought in Cromartie few seasons ago and they were really good. Also if AP isn’t picked up soon and goes beyond draft I would offer him one year deal to back up Johnson as insurance.

  8. By joe holst on Mar 16, 2017 | Reply

    Go get Jamaal Charles, stay clear of the 2 Clemson boys, Deshaun Watson and Mike Williams, 2 busts.

  9. By sbrown on Mar 16, 2017 | Reply

    be realistic, 20+ free agents and not much in the way of cap space, what did you think was going to happen ???

    I have been pleased with the moves so far, no way could the team sign three or four big money free agents, just no cap room to do it.

    Now with a deep draft in defensive backs, receivers and linemen, now is the time a good draft will help fill a couple of open positions, and help give depth to the overall roster.

    All we can do is wait and see how the draft plays out ( Round 1 in only 41 days …)
    and any after draft signings, either non drafted players or players that have been cut by other teams.

  10. By georgiebird on Mar 16, 2017 | Reply

    There’s something about trying Justin Bethel and Brandon Williams again in 2017. Is that the definition of “Insanity” ?

  11. By Jamessamuels1932 on Mar 16, 2017 | Reply

    The Cards signed Bethel a contract last year to be the starting corner but Bethels foot surgery ruined his first year to compete for that spot.
    How can we judge Bethels first year as being a failure when He was injured and didn’t even have a chance to prove himself.
    Honeybadger was hurt last year(and many more)…but no ridicule for Matthieu and his poor seasons.

  12. By Tradersbrain on Mar 16, 2017 | Reply

    Darren,
    I re-watched the first AZ v SEA game (6-6 tie) and was surprised to see Palmer heave a hail mary 70 yards to end regulation. Even Collinsworth was impressed with Palmer’s arm strength. Further, Palmer appeared to get stronger as the year progressed. Are we that certain that 2017 will be his last year? I, like BA, think that if he stays healthy he can play at a high level for another 2-3 years.

  13. By Darren Urban on Mar 17, 2017 | Reply

    Traders —

    RE: Palmer

    No, nothing is certain. He said himself he’s taking it year to year. But I would not be surprised if this is it for him.

  14. By aschatte on Mar 16, 2017 | Reply

    another 2-14 or 3-13 season, nothing new for the Cardinals fans. As long as as we can be competitive in all the games, I will take that as a good sign. Lets be fair, last year was an aberration, we still needed most of the defensive front to stay in contention which alas we dont have any more. We had our chances in the last 2-3 years and we failed to capitalize. Lets a grow a team again and hope for the best.FA isnt over yet but who else is left or we can lose? I still want Fitz to win a SB ring…

  15. By Christian on Mar 16, 2017 | Reply

    Smity-

    I guess you take the cake on dates comments (the last Cardinals winless season was when they merged with the Steelers in ’44). You also left out that they are tied with the Lions and Tigers in that statistic (even though the Tigers haven’t been a team for years).

    I don’t think any FA CB this season, including Gilmore, would have been better than the top three in the draft (four before Jones was injured).

  16. By lg on Mar 16, 2017 | Reply

    Darrelle Revis need a one year deal get him keim

  17. By Christian on Mar 16, 2017 | Reply

    JTDG and mitchaz and anyone else with an opinion-

    Re: Feeney

    Out of curiosity, how low do you possibly see Feeney falling? I (as a Hoosier) like him, but I know he isn’t worth pick 13 and don’t think he will be there by 45. On the other hand, I see a lot of mock drafts and draft “experts” who have him available beyond 45. So I’m just curious about what you guys think.

  18. By GARY HICKERSON on Mar 16, 2017 | Reply

    Fans remember’ this is” real football” not fantasy football!! THE CARDINALS have to play by the rules just like every other team in the NFL. and that means having a cap on how much every team spends to keep things as even as possible, otherwise only the richest owners/teams would get all the best players..,Reading some of the posts above makes me wonder if they realize that!! the CARDINALS have enough good players (and if certain players step up!!)To make a run for the SB…BUT CARDINALS do need to draft another starting shut down corner opposite PP,ALSO A QB,DT,,WR OR SAFETY–GO CARDINALS!!

  19. By CardinalChris on Mar 16, 2017 | Reply

    Maybe the front office sees enough talent on the team, or the front office has determined the available free agents aren’t any better than the current roster… Which, if true, would be a nice change from teams in the past which needed a ton of help in free agency because there wasn’t enough talent/depth on the team. Bethel wasn’t healthy until the last two weeks of the season. We get injured players back in the secondary/ at WR/ at OL

    Would like to see Sio Moore and Frosty come back though…

  20. By Scott H on Mar 17, 2017 | Reply

    The need for a CB was there…..there were CB’s available…..none of them have landed here…..and the big fat question mark at CB remains.

    This organization has been big on finding that veteran defensive player on a one-year deal that really seemed to fill the hole pretty nicely ( if only FOR one year ). Well, this sure would have seemed like a good time for one of those.

    This team looks nowhere near where it needs to be on defense. Not if they want us to believe they are a legit SB contender. Is anyone seeing it???

    Right now, our options at CB opposite PP and Justin Bethel ( last year’s failure in progress ) and Brandon Williams? Really? We’ve already forgotten how that worked out last year???

    And we’ve allowed it to progress to this point, having these options, with a guy like Brandon Carr right there for the taking until yesterday?

    Sorry, but I think I see another failure in progress – this off-season. So far, the Cardinals have been a loser.

  21. By Rob on Mar 17, 2017 | Reply

    I thought we were going to be aggressive in FA? That’s what Keim and Bidwell told us. We still have needs at CB, S, ILB, DT, OL and WR. We can’t draft potential starters for all those positions in this draft, so we need to fill some of those holes with free agents. The available FA talent pool is shrinking fast. Nothing but crickets from the Cards front office. Are we going to try to make another run for the title or are we giving up?

  22. By clssylssy on Mar 17, 2017 | Reply

    Come on Mr. Bidwill…our first round pick for Richard Sherman! Be a man of your word & give Fitz (and us long suffering fans) a snowball’s chance in Hell @ the Division (and that ring)!!!

  23. By Christian on Mar 17, 2017 | Reply

    Re: Revis

    We can’t afford Revis. He would forfeit the 6 million the Jets owe him if he signs a contract elsewhere, and he can’t get a contract for that much after last season. The money is technically there, but not realistically.

    Re: Veteran

    Most of those signings happen after the draft and aren’t big-names like Clairborne and Carr were. This FA group wasn’t good to begin with.

    Re: Sherman

    LOL. Panic/exaggerate/dream much?

  24. By michael on Mar 17, 2017 | Reply

    Jamessamuels-

    Re: Bethel

    We saw a healthy Bethel at CB in the playoffs vs the Packers when Mathieu was injured and he was forced into action. It wasn’t pretty. and that was with Cobb injured ealry, so Bethel was matched up vs their #3 and #4 WRs and was getting mugged. How is he going to fare against real #2s week in and week out? So, yes, putting Bethel/williams out there week 1 would be insanity

    clearly a Cb will be drafted in Rd 1 or 2, but there has to eb a veteran CB who cna be there to start right away. In SK’s defense, he does look for a longer, bigger CB, and guys like Verner and Flowers are smaller while the other s CBs who;s signed have been getting $6M per year or more. Logan Ryan got 3 years/$30M. Brandon Carr was 2 years $12M, just odn’t have that space.

    Gotta be confident SK is trolling the veteran cuts for that #2CB.

  25. By Adam Smith b1723 fka DTL on Mar 17, 2017 | Reply

    If rookies take $6M, and remaining cap is $21M, then Keim has room to still deal. So, with draft and some $$ on hand, more to come… patience…

  26. By Joe C. on Mar 17, 2017 | Reply

    Folks,
    There will be cuts made of competent players. We got Cooper for a seventh rounder. There will be some o-linemen released due to money and age. The worst thing we can do is trade first rounders for aging veterans or mortgage future cap space for current year. We have a good team. Who knows what undrafted free agent will be the sensation of the league next year. Our needs are in positions where unheralded players emerge or veterans on one year deals excel.

  27. By Scott H on Mar 17, 2017 | Reply

    As far as our need at CB being addressed through the draft…..well, first of all, at this point, doesn’t it kinda have to be????? It sure isn’t being addressed anywhere else, so….

    OK, maybe a rookie CB can fill that spot. But let’s be real – that is a big maybe, folks. How many CB’s come into the league and lock down one side of the field for a team in year one??

    And keep in mind, any rookie CB who comes to THIS team is going to be playing opposite PP – one of the best in the business – who deflects a lot of passes to the other side of the field. That puts even more heat on whoever is going to be over there.

    Didn’t we try a rookie at that spot last year? And even if Brandon Williams was pushed into a starting role by other circumstances, the bottom line is he played very poorly.

    Building through the draft is a fine thing but that doesn’t mean everyone is going to be a starter / impact player right away. But it seems to me we, as Cardinals fans, should know that. See Robert Nkemdiche.

    I swear, I’m still waiting / hoping for a trade on par with the one they made for Chandler Jones last year after our initial attempts to secure a pass rusher fell flat.

  28. By Don on Mar 17, 2017 | Reply

    All these people complaining about FA, I’m pretty happy with it CONSIDERING we had no money to speak of. Hard to be aggressive when you are counting pennies. I wish we had grabbed Patterson for special teams but otherwise I think SK knows what he is doing. There will be more pick ups before and after the draft to fill need just as we grabbed Cooper last year.

  29. By JTDG on Mar 17, 2017 | Reply

    Christian,

    Feeney.

    Your right, mock drafts have him all over the place. Mainly because there is a lot of talent in other areas and O Lineman aren’t sexy picks.

    But they are very important.

    Feeney is a tough guy. His projections are all over, but I see him as a solid round 2 guy. I think he will be there with pick 45.

    There are some talent at oline this year. Forest Lamp and Ryan Ramzyck are my two favorites. I also really like Pat Elflien. I thought Dion Dawkins was excellent senior bowl week.

    Zack Banner is a huge massive man, who some love and some hate. Depending if one of those love teams decide to move on him, he could go high in round 2.

    I think Nico Siragusa is a sleeper who could start quickly.

    So, Feeney to me could fall anywhere in round two, and depending the QBs and on a run at CB and LB, could fall to beginning of round 3. But he is a starting guard or center.

  30. By JTDG on Mar 17, 2017 | Reply

    Wait, am I hearing excuses for Keim

    No money. really? Is that true?

    We are waiting to pick up someone from cuts? So your solution to CB2 is a cut player? OK.

    Man, some people just follow blindly. Sometimes, instead of being enamoured with the big and mighty OZ, you may want to see who is really behind the curtain.

  31. By Joe C. on Mar 17, 2017 | Reply

    JTDG,
    Do you really think there is no one out there, including our own players, that can’t fill the CB2 role? Some of these folks make it sound like having PP is a liability because now your CB2 will be picked on. I’m not saying we’ll have or find an all pro. We should have a great pass rush. That doesn’t hurt.

  32. By mitchaz on Mar 17, 2017 | Reply

    Christian—

    I agree with a lot of what JTDG said about Dan Feeney. Big, rugged and skilled. Excelled versus top competition in Big Ten. Had a very good showing at the Senior Bowl.

    The one concern is the concussion he suffered this past season. It probably won’t be a factor unless he suffers a second one.

    I think he’s the 2nd best G in the draft behind Forrest Lamp.

    He certainly would be part of the discussion at #45 if he is on the board. Not sure though if he would be the highest need at that point, especially with such strong needs at CB and FS.

  33. By clssylssy on Mar 17, 2017 | Reply

    Christian…
    Having the #1 &#2 Corners would fix a lot with our defense and possibly make up for some of Keim;s previous decisions. Anybody we get in the draft is going to be facing a steep learning curve and it’s going to take something radical for us to even surpass our last season’s sub .500 showing.
    Don’t panic–the Cards would never do anything so aggressive as signing Sherman, we might be too successful as to screw up our draft order for next season!

  34. By Scott H on Mar 17, 2017 | Reply

    JTDG –

    Thank you. I was thinking the same. But really, what were you and I thinking?? What kind of idiots are we? Of course! It’s so simple – we’ll just wait for the guys other teams cut to fill in the holes on our defense! Yes! That’s the ticket!

    Whew…that’s a load off my mind.

    OK, end of sarcasm. But, really, you do not make SB runs by hitting the bargain basement rack. You just don’t. It doesn’t happen. Who in their right mind believes a GOOD CB ( say, on par with a Brandon Carr ) is going to be cut by another team???

    And who in their right mind believes this defense is going to get it done with anything less than a GOOD CB on the other side of the field? We tried that last year. Didn’t work.

    And let’s be real – it ain’t like we’re just totally dialed in everywhere else on defense, and ALL we need is a GOOD CB to seal the deal. Let’s review…

    Calais Campbell – as of this moment, there is no replacement for him.

    Robert Nkemdiche – a total question mark. That is why we cannot call him a replacement for Calais Campbell.

    Honey Badger’s health – total question mark. How can ya say it’s not???

    Karlos Dansy / Antoine Bethea – should both make contributions, based on their histories. But at 32 and 36?? Let’s not consider these questions completely answered.

    Tyvon Branch – well, when he finally plays…..maybe we’ll see. More of a question mark until proven otherwise.

    And, finally, the CB spot opposite Patrick Peterson – as ridiculous as it seems at this point, still a TOTAL question mark.

    Folks, they only allow 11 defensive players on the field at a time. Right now, we’ve got too many question marks in this mix.

  35. By Joe Cardea on Mar 17, 2017 | Reply

    Classy, you think Carroll has something on us when he signs Lacey but you think we’re crazy not to go after Sherman.

  36. By clssylssy on Mar 18, 2017 | Reply

    Joe…
    I said I think that the Lacy signing is VERY interesting (apparently others around the league share my optimism) and Carroll’s system and the incentive layered contract COULD work for Lacy and be a win-win. My suggestion about Sherman was a little tongue in cheek, as the Cards would never do anything so radical, although you have to admit having the #1 and #2 corners would really make our defense pretty scary.
    I do think Lacy could be a surprise and is the sort of experiment I would expect from Carroll. I saw Lacy play when he was at Wisconsin and he had talent–never thought he was a fit for Green Bay or their coach.
    Sometimes it’s all a matter of chemistry and a proper fit for a system,which is why we see players “break out” after going to new teams from their original team who drafted them. Maturity also plays a big role but this isn’t a one size fits all league, which fans forget when the draft rolls around,
    Time will tell about all! We can only hope for the best while being prepared for the worse. Last year we bought into the hype that resulted in a very unpleasant elevator ride from the penthouse to the outhouse.
    “Fool me once, shame on you,,,fool me twice, shame on me:!

  37. By CardsNation on Mar 18, 2017 | Reply

    I truly think that Keim should’ve taken a CB in free agency. The draft will determine if we are successful or not next season.

  38. By Scott H on Mar 18, 2017 | Reply

    clssy –

    Ya know, I would never have even considered a trade for Sherman…..until you mentioned it!

    But ya know what – why not? Really. Why not? If we’re not going all in this year, then….what’s the point? And the fact that we’re paying Palmer and Fitz what we’re paying them to ( apparently ) stick around for one more year says to me we are supposed to be going all in. Look, I can only speak to where it sits right now. And where it sits right now is we still have a Texas-sized whole at CB. It doesn’t look like we’re doing anything to address that need via FA and I do not suscribe to the belief that we’re going to find our guy – the guy we need for THIS season – in the draft. So? A trade? Why not?

    Don’t know about the feasibility of a trade for Richard Sherman….gotta be careful about what you give to a division rival. But I would love to TAKE a player like Sherman from a division rival. How cool would that be???

    But a trade? Yeah, I’m in. It is basically what I’m hoping for at this point.

    I have no problem saying this – I don’t care about 2018 and beyond right now. We know we are heading for some down years because we know our QB is gone after this year. So, let’s load the guns with every bullet we have NOW and go guns blazin’ in 2017. If that means giving up a draft pick in 2018, so be it. For the right player, I’m in.

    I feel like I’m not seeing that so far. But a trade for a CB would sure put some juice into an off-season that has gone flat.

    The extensions we gave Palmer and Fitz to keep them here through 2017 gave the impression that we were looking to keep this window open. But this off-season has not kept pace with the impression those extensions created.

  39. By clssylssy on Mar 18, 2017 | Reply

    Thanks Scott…good to know we are still on the same page! I totally with you on all points. Let’s make this our year and deal with the future as it unfolds!

  40. By Scott H on Mar 19, 2017 | Reply

    clssy –

    I don’t really WANT to be on this page….maybe you don’t either….but as always, we’re callin’ it like we see it.

  41. By JTDG on Mar 19, 2017 | Reply

    Joe C

    Question about CB2;

    There is no one currently on our roster who can fill the CB2 spot as a Man Corner.
    What you saw a lot last year was a team that went to zone often to make up for the lack of a man CB.

    If you start playing the zone coverage (which is something they may do more of this year) you really need safeties who can cover deep. Whether they play 3 deep, two deep or any other variations.

    Now that the cards have players who can win their one on one battles on rushing the passer, they may not choose to blitz as much. They got rid of Minter and replaced him with a guy good in coverage.

    So, could williams play in a cover two coverage with a safety playing the deep half, probably. There is a CB named Alterrann Verner who could be a good zone option.

    But here is my two issues.

    One, I am not a fan of zones. I am more of a Todd Bowles gambling defense that blitzes the A gaps and puts pressure on QBs.

    Two, I think it is a waste of having the best CB in the game. Having Peterson playing the other teams best receiver is a luxury most teams would love. Putting him in a cover 2 or 3, puts him in a situation where he isn’t doing his best. It is better for the team for him to cover the top receiver also.

    So, if you stay with the mostly man strategy , Williams or Bethel just are not good enough and I am not sure there is someone out there who could play that spot. The only guy out there who could be a possible CB2 is Revis. He understands playing man and covering the #2 receiver will make up for his eroding skills. Doubt it will happen.

    If you go to zone, then draft a guy like Teez Tabor, who will be a physical presence and then trade Peterson for a 1 and 2 in 2018.

    I think, if you go man, you have two options ; Revis and a draft pick like Humphries.

  42. By JTDG on Mar 20, 2017 | Reply

    Joe C,

    There is also the possibility of a trade. We saw it last year to get our passrusher.

    I would love for the cards to trade for Joe Haden. This is a very good man CB and would allow the cards to play a more pressure type defense.

    Trading for Haden , who is 27, isn’t that expensive either. The Browns already gave him his bonuses and guaranteed money. The cards would just take on his salary of 3 years 33 million. Which is much less than what they would have paid Bouye or Gilmore.

    Haden for a 2nd rounder makes sense and the Browns are looking to move him.

  43. By KMART on Mar 20, 2017 | Reply

    Darren,

    Any chance that Keim and BA are looking at Ladarius Webb for that CB2 spot? Also Revis had all his charges dropped, any interest there on a 1-year deal?

  44. By Darren Urban on Mar 20, 2017 | Reply

    Kmart —

    RE: CBs

    Not hearing anything as of now.

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