Whiz wrap, featuring the fumble that wasn’t

Posted by Darren Urban on October 3, 2011 – 11:44 am

Coach Ken Whisenhunt was philosophical about the Victor Cruz fumble-that-was-called-“given up,” saying it shouldn’t have mattered and that his opinion doesn’t matter either.

“I’ll be perfectly honest with you: It really doesn’t matter what I think,” Whisenhunt said.”I threw the challenge flag and they wouldn’t allow me to challenge, so they made the ruling and I have no choice to live by the ruling. But I’ll tell you this … if we had done some of the things we should have, it wouldn’t have come to that.

Whisenhunt was asked about other situations, including how the Cards approach such a play. “I was in Pittsburgh for the Plaxico incident in Jacksonville,” he said, noting Plaxico Burress’ infamous spiking of the ball after a catch — when he was not touched down — and having the Jaguars recover. “We have a play, we call it ‘Down-Down-Call-A-Timeout’ or ‘Down-Down-Spike-It’ and we tell guys to get down and give themselves up, but we tell our guys slide, or taking a knee and holding on to the ball. The idea is to declare yourself down and to give the ball to the official so he can get it spotted quickly enough so you can get the next play going. Instead of leaving the ball there so (the officials) have to get it.”

Whisenhunt said he hoped the play didn’t have a residual effect (as Calais Campbell suggested) but if it did, the players had better learn from it.

I still don’t understand why Cruz would have been in such a hurry down three with three minutes on the clock at the Cards’ 29-yard line to need a “give-up,” but the officials didn’t see it that way.

Among the other notes from Whiz’s talk:

— RT Brandon Keith had swelling on his knee. Jeremy Bridges “did an OK job” replacing Keith, Whisenhunt said, and whether Keith returns to the lineup will depend on his health, Whisenhunt said. Otherwise, Bridges can step in.

— RB Beanie Wells is sore, but otherwise no worse for wear after getting 27 carries one week after missing a game with a hamstring problem.

— QB Kevin Kolb needs to get more comfortable in the offense so that he will make the consistent right reads and remain in the pocket more often. That, in Whisenhunt’s opinion, clearly is going to take more time. He is trying to have patience, but he knows the Cards need to win in the meantime. “I feel for the player and the fans,” he said.

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84 Responses to “Whiz wrap, featuring the fumble that wasn’t”

  1. By Gilbert on Oct 3, 2011 | Reply

    Tuff to loose but hopefully they can turn things around I see an 8 n 8 season. Hey Darren do u see the ownership being frustrated enough to want to make changes in the coach or are they being patient because it’s not all the coaching staff or is it in your view?? Cuz in my view the leadership of this team clearly wants to win. Hence all the spending and effort to lift this team to a higher level. What’s your take

  2. By Darren Urban on Oct 3, 2011 | Reply

    Gilbert —

    RE: Coaching

    They are not going to change coaches this season.

  3. By Mary on Oct 3, 2011 | Reply

    PLEASE, PLEASE find william Powell and get him back on the roster!!

  4. By Jim in Missouri on Oct 3, 2011 | Reply

    Hey Darren, I posted this in the Sunday “aftermath” comments section and was curious if you have any thoughts on it. If you don’t feel comfortable answering, as a Cardinals and therefore NFL employee, I understand …

    I agree it shouldn’t have come to that non-fumble play and I’m still not big on conspiracies, but let me throw a couple of hypotheticals at you …

    1) If that non-fumble play was happening when the Cardinals were on offense and the Giants on defense, and it was Early Doucet who slipped down, then lost the ball and the Giants recovered, what do you think the call is?

    2) If instead of losing the ball after slipping down, what do you think the call would have been if Cruz got back up and ran into the end zone without being touched? Do you think the call would have been that he “gave himself up” and was down, or touchdown Giants?

    I think no matter the circumstances, that play would have been called in the Giants’ favor, and it makes me sick. If a call like that goes against the Giants, it’s a national outrage from a NYC team and splashed all over the back pages of the tabloids for 2-3 days. But since it’s lowly Arizona and they’re not good anyway, why should a questionable call go the Cardinals’ way?

  5. By Darren Urban on Oct 3, 2011 | Reply

    Jim in Missouri —

    RE: Fumble questions

    I don’t believe the call had anything to do with who was wearing the uniform. I just think it was a (very) bad call. As for your second point, I guess it would depend when the whistle blew. Even though I was down on the field, I can’t remember if there was a whistle before the “fumble” or not.

  6. By Tx Cards fan on Oct 3, 2011 | Reply

    If the Cardinals get more than 6 points on their first 3 red zone trips the game would have been out of reach and the play wouldn’t matter. Also when you are 3rd in the NFL for the most penalty yard (296) you will not get the benefit of the doubt with the ref’s. This is the time of year where there is a enough film of sloppy teams and dirty players that ref’s know who to watch. But overall as frustrating as that call was if the Cardinals are taking care of business in the red zone and play good football (low number of penalties / mistakes) that call never matters. At some point sloppy football always catches up to you.

  7. By cfansinc75 on Oct 3, 2011 | Reply

    Hey Darren,
    Is there a statistic on winning percentage by teams up by 2 scores w/ 5 minutes left in the game. I can’t believe we blew another one that way.

  8. By Darren Urban on Oct 3, 2011 | Reply

    cfansinc75 —

    RE: Stat

    I am sure Elias has that somewhere. But I do not have access to it.

  9. By APCARDS on Oct 3, 2011 | Reply

    That was so tough to be at that game and watch it slip away! Especially with the annoying Giants fans! Next week better be a W-we are traveling to MN to go to the Cards game and support!!!!
    I hope Jeremey Bridges can start in place of B. Keith or Levi Brown. Kolb seems more confident with Bridges there. I was happy to see Beanie get over 100 yards. LSH needs to go back to returning too!
    Darren-is there any chance that Ben Graham will be re-signed??? I think he is better than Zastudil. Any chance for LSH to return kicks again?

  10. By Darren Urban on Oct 3, 2011 | Reply

    APCards —

    RE: Graham/Hyphen

    As I said before, I think Hyphen is just precautionary because his hand isn’t 100 percent. No, I don’t think they would bring back Graham.

  11. By Don Short on Oct 3, 2011 | Reply

    By being philosophical, Whiz is setting up the team for more hosings by the officials. Do you think Bill Parcells would have acted like Whiz? The coach should show his team that he cares. I wish I could say about the coach, like he said about Bridges, that he did an okay job.

  12. By cactus jeff on Oct 3, 2011 | Reply

    I went bird watching with my son. We heard the call “Cheap, Cheap, Cheap.” What is that? he said…..Son, it’s called an Arizona Cardinal!

    They were going cheap in FA this year up until fans revolted the DRC Kolb trade…Then they picked up local TE Heap after acquiring King TE on the cheap. No way you can convince me that they weren’t panicking. THen the fans were back on board, and what happens, NOTHING. No # 2WR.

    Play a 4-3, play Housler more and bench Roberts and they still could have a good year, otherwise another year of fans asking the team to spend money and another token todd heap signing….ugh

  13. By We Missed Q on Oct 3, 2011 | Reply

    As a fan I got more angry watching Whiz’s press conference that watching the Cards blow another game. I am TIRED of hearing the same old lines, and excuses from him. “We have to clean some things up”, “there were plays out there to be made” “I like the way our team responded” I have now heard these same line in every single post loss presser. I am now VERY concerned about this coach and his staff. How many people are left from the team he inherited? AW, DD, Fitz, and Duece? Duece aside I am pretty sure everyone would agree those are our 3 best players. Where is the talent Whiz has brought in in 5 years? How many pro bowlers in 5 drafts(35+ players) and free agency? ZERO that is how many. I am sorry to say but it is becoming more and more OBVIOUS Warner made Whiz, not the other way around. He hires a coach from Pitts, who keeps putting rookie corners in bad positions. Of course if AW could cover ANYONE or knew his assignments maybe Hicks would not have scored the last TD. Sure looked to me AW was supposed to have deep help, as he had no other responsibility. Porter and Haggans were both good 4 years ago and do nothing now. And don’t even get me started on Levi Brown…UUURRRRGGGHHH!!!

  14. By CardsFan on Oct 3, 2011 | Reply

    That was a horrible call but the way I see it is, that Kevin Kolb has not found a way to finish a game. Had he not went 3 & out on that last drive(especially being at home & not being able to put the nail in the coffin) we could have kept the drive going & the clock running. Is it just me or do you see the pattern of him not being able to finish???
    I do believe after the bye week we will see a much more different & confident Cardinal team that WILL FINISH A GAME STRONG & not be fighting for their fighting for their Win in the 4th quarter

  15. By wnycardfan on Oct 3, 2011 | Reply

    screw the fumble that wasn’t. We should have been able to play prevent defense at that time withotu worrying about a score because we had done the right things earlier in the game. Whiz is so vanilla, I know he’s not going to yell or give away their game plan secrets just to make us feel better, but can we get some motiviation and energy? Can the team show it sometime? If the losing continues the questions are only going to get more intense (as they should). We need to find what it takes to win, asap.

  16. By Peter in Canada on Oct 3, 2011 | Reply

    I for one am not down on Whiz, Graves, Kolb or the team.
    We have lost three games by a total of 8 points which is a definite upgrade over last year although the won/lost record doesn’t indicate it.
    The expectations of Kolb were high because the Cards paid a high price for him. However he has shown that while he has ability he is not consistent enough and has too many faults to be able to carry a team like Warner could. The potential is there and he should be allowed the chance to realize it. Those calls for Bartel are simply knee-jerk reactions.
    Beanie was great and I hope that he has finally turned the corner and can performe like this in every game. His pass blocking has definitely improved.
    Porter has been very disappointing. A poster said that Campbell should be turned into a pass rushing linebacker a la Mario Williams. He certainly showed speed when he ran down a WR on the goal line. Darren do you think it is possible to do this?
    Our corners lack experience but I think they will improve over the season. People forget that Jefferson was practice squad last year.
    I also think Levi Brown is being villified more than he deserves. I thought he was o.k. yesterday. Kolb’s happy feet sometimes make him look bad.
    Roberts has been a disappointment. He doesn’t get thrown to very much. Is it his fault or Kolb’s What do you think?
    We will beat Minny and hopefully move on from there.

  17. By TUCCARS00 on Oct 3, 2011 | Reply

    IN WHIZ I TRUST. IN CARDS PLAYERS I TRUST. IN HORTON I TRUST. This was a good game. The defense looks as if they are almost there. The offense looks like they are almost there. Great teams learn from games in which things don’t go their way. I believe in the talent that the Cardinals have and the X-Factor personalities of the Cardinals players. They seem to mesh well on the field with each other. In my opinion, A CLICK away at putting it together. If I could give advise to the players it would be to stay positive. Positive in your ability to do your job. Positive by keeping your head held high in the face of defeat. I as a Cardinals fan BELIEVE. Keep the faith and keep moving foward.

  18. By pipapiko on Oct 3, 2011 | Reply

    Whiz is a clown and needs to get fired along with graves! A lot of money spent on two players not benefiting the team overall. Cards go 4-16 if that!

  19. By NJCardsFan on Oct 3, 2011 | Reply

    I am sick to my stomach. I had to hear it from all my Giants fan friends out here in Jersey after I was rubbing it in to all of them that we were gonna win. IT WAS THE WORST !! Only that stuff (the Cruz non-fumble)happens to the Cards but even so, they should not have been in that situation in the first place. WHY THE HECK WOULDN’T KOLB GET RID OF THE BALL ON THE SCREEN ATTEMPT INSTEAD OF TAKING THE SACK ?? and WHY THE HECK DIDN’T THEY CALL THE TIMEOUT ON THE 4TH DOWN PLAY !?!? I might have to quit the Cards and football all together. This aggrivation is not worth it week in and week out with this damn football team.
    P.S I love the Cards too much to ever do that. Its just frustrating cause this team should be 4-0 right now.

  20. By MIKE G on Oct 3, 2011 | Reply

    Hey Darren – That was a very bad call that went against the Cardinals. I really dont understand how a ref could judge that a player gave up on the play. The play is still alive to me. The receiver was out of control and why the Cardinal players didnt try to touch him I just dont understand. These type of plays is why you have instant replay & then you are not allowed to challenge it. The whole thing is ridiculous to me The key question is when did the whisltle blow???.Bottom line its a fumble. This play seemed to change momentum and Cardinals clearly struggled at the end of the game. On an aside I was impressed with Dan Williams and Carter on the nose— They played well. Darren–Did you have a feeling when the Card’s had to settle for three on their first two scores that it would come back to haunt them?????

  21. By Darren Urban on Oct 3, 2011 | Reply

    Mike G —

    RE: Early mistakes in RZ

    Honestly, I thought it was a moot point after Beanie scored his final touchdown. They were up 10 with five minutes left. That ought to be enough.

  22. By Bernardo on Oct 3, 2011 | Reply

    First of all,
    Jim In Missouri made such a dang good point! What would the call have been if he would have gotten back up and ran for a TD?? It would have been a way different call. Its wouldnt have been “gave himself up”.
    But thats beyond the point, I would like to touch on a few things, I LOVE LOVE LOVE how we ran Beanie. That guy is a huge RB and he will wear out a defense.. and that way later in the game when we need 2 yards we can get it….. Wait a second! Didnt that scenario happen? and we threw the ball. Iam not the fan that is gunna blame 4 plays on the whole game. But i do believe what you do early in the game sets up for the end of the game. And we have a common denominator in these past few games. The game isnt adding up.

  23. By Orange slice on Oct 3, 2011 | Reply

    I’ve been reading this Blog for over a year and I think some of you fans or so call fans or a trip !
    Don’t you realize that the cards or trying to build a
    Good team they are not their yet! All you do is get on
    this blog and talk about the players and talk about the coaches. The team might not be winning games but
    they are playing a hell of lot better than they did
    last yr.That being said the safety needs to step up and help the corners and the 60million man needs to
    pass better.

  24. By Chad D. on Oct 3, 2011 | Reply

    So we are 1-3. We got beat by the better team in 2 instances (obviously not the Seahawks). Giants are the better team. Why? Other than injuries, they have been together longer. Eli knows the offense. Their pass rush is better, their receivers are better (except Fitz, of course), they play teams that are better (their division foes), and they won. If you would have asked me last Saturday who was going to win, I’d say the Giants. Easy choice. We almost won with a stellar run game, modest passing, virtually a rookie QB, 2 rookie CB’s, a new DC and refs that seem biased. We have no business thinking we should win games until we do just that. If most of you are honest with yourselves, you wouldn’t have us winning this game. Be happy that we were close and competitive and more importantly that we are giving every team a run for their money. We start getting creamed by Kansas City or Seattle and sure, be pissed.
    I am not dumb, I see that we have a ton of work to do, starting with our secondary, safeties included, and ending with our O-line and QB. I still think that once we taste how to close out games we can expect to win half of the close ones, but until then relax and enjoy the show! It is obviously riveting football and if it isn’t riveting then you can bet the officiating will try its best to make it that way!

  25. By mizzourrah2002 on Oct 3, 2011 | Reply

    Re: Peter in Canada
    Re: Tuccarsoo

    I second, both of these comments!

    I expected the cardinals to a 7-9 win team. That is still very attainable!

    There is two sides to every coin. If Whiz was visibly furious (a la Denny Green) that wouldn’t make me feel any better. People calling for Whiz to show passion clearly don’t see him on the sidelines, where he displays plenty of emotion when dealing with players. IMO a coach that remains calm despite calamity is a good leader.

    The reality from what I have seen, is that we are not that far off. We have played 4 competitive games and have shown flashes of being a winning team. Bringing the whole package together may take some time, but this should be expected.

    There has been so much change its hard to imagine a season without some decent sized bumps in the road.

    Stay strong Cardinal Nation!

  26. By Procen on Oct 3, 2011 | Reply


    Do you think the problem is the offensive coaching or just the entire offensive players is having problem communicating? The Cards has a lot of talents and the way they are playing is like the other team knows their playbook. In my opinion they need to change the offensive coordinator, need a better one that can extract the talent out of the players. BTW Levi Brown is still awful!

  27. By Darren Urban on Oct 3, 2011 | Reply

    Procen —

    RE: Offensive issues

    I think there are multiple things that need to be better. I still think there is communication gaps. I think Kolb needs to trust himself and the offense a little more. I do think it’s execution right now more than scheme.

  28. By mwhizzie on Oct 3, 2011 | Reply

    ok for all of u screaming and criticizing whiz needs to stop, it is not whiz’s fault that the team is not responding to being able to finish the game. all you can ask for out of a whiz and this coaching staff is for them to make the necessary calls and decisions to put your players in the best position to win the game it is based on their (the players) performence that dictates whether you win or lose the game. hey and guess what we have lost by 1, 3,and now 4 points that is a score affair and not only that a fumble, int, and sack due to kolb’s doings is what has costed the cards these losses. whiz and his staff are putting us in the position to win every week so far u wanna blame someone blame the players, blowing covereges, missing assignments, lack of blocking, costly turnovers when the game is dying down, bad reads, overthrowing are main weapon. all in all though we will take this division we have minny this week and guess what sf has tb and during our bye week they play detroit … yea good luck niners two potential losses in the mix, we beat minny and come back from the bye and play the steelers well were right back in this thing guys… everyone just needs to calm down and let everything settle itself out there is a ton of football left. darren do u know if the cards will start using anthony sherman alot more as a hot type route he did really well yesterday and i think he would be perfect for an escape route for kolb

  29. By Matt in Philly on Oct 3, 2011 | Reply

    Some valid points on this thread. What really sticks out is the idea of personnel. We have a number of VETERAN starters on this team who don’t measure up to what we need at their position: Joey Porter, Clark Haggans, Levi Brown, and Adrian Wilson. Great teams make the proper moves so that they aren’t STARTING underperforming VETERANS. It’s one thing for young guys to not put up the numbers — they have room to grow — but we’ve pretty much seen all we’re going to see out of those four guys. The problem is, we don’t even have any quality youngsters to push those guys — Schofield, Acho, and Rashad Johnson are 3rd round picks that aren’t going to cut it as starters. can’t blame the coaches for that. That’s bad management (Graves).

    It really hurts to say that A-Dub is hurting the team. We all love him. But he’s a huge liability in coverage. I know it’s a quixotic idea, but would it be possible to move him to the OLB position to utilize his strength of getting to the QB from the edge? Rashad Johnson is probably a downgrade from A-Dub, but at lest we’d get some edge pressure.

  30. By Matt in Philly on Oct 3, 2011 | Reply

    Also: did anyone see Calvin Johnson this weekend. How come Detroit manages to hit their star receiver in triple coverage, but we can’t? Their QB has only 5 more career starts than ours.

  31. By Darren Urban on Oct 3, 2011 | Reply

    Matt in Philly —

    RE: Calvin vs Fitz

    What’s the difference between the CJ catch and what Fitz did in Seattle?

    And let’s face it, there is luck involved. If Dallas picks that ball off, is it still a smart move? Kolb heaved a second one up for Fitz yesterday, just like everyone has screamed for, and it was picked.

  32. By BIG RED 66 on Oct 3, 2011 | Reply

    Darn, I was hoping Whisenhunt would resign today and admit that he only rode Denny Greens players to the Super Bowl. Fully admit that he can’t game plan and that his player decisions have been a complete joke as he has chased off (Boldin) or let them go elsewhere (Dansby, Rolle) have produced nothing but a apathetic team that just doesn’t really give a crap as long as they are getting paid. Kolb isn’t playing that great but why would you not keep feeding Beanie when this is known. Jeff Fisher or the REAL STEELERS coach Cowher is starting to sound real nice. Sorry Whiz the ride on Denny Greens players is over and you might be to.

  33. By rojobird on Oct 3, 2011 | Reply

    Its time that coaches take responsobilty for how their team is performing but u would never see that from SIR WHIZ and SIR HORTON… Kolb needs to stand up to Sir Whiz and let him know that his and his coaches play calling are not working. If he is going to be our future QB act like like the leader and not the follower….. Kolb seems to choke when the game is close specially in the 4th qtr he needs to overcome that someway somehow…. LOVE MY CARDS I KNOW YOU WILL DO BETTER FROM THE NEXT GAME FORWARD PLAY WITH THE SAME PASSION YOU DID THE GIANTS AND YOU SHOULD BE FINE.. REMEMBER WE HAVE LOST A GAME BY 1 POINT, A GAME BY 3 POINTS AND A GAME BY 4 POINTS SO IN REALITY NOBODY HAS REALLY DOMINANTED US WE LOST CUZ WE COULD NOT CLOSE OUT THE GAMES…. BEST OF LUCK…

  34. By Brandon LA on Oct 3, 2011 | Reply


    This whole pocket thing with Kolb. Is this because we are holding on to a Warner-centric offense? Cause (obviously) he was good sticking in the pocket.

    PS i love beanie wells. he will run u over. period dot dot dot

  35. By Darren Urban on Oct 3, 2011 | Reply

    Brandon LA —

    RE: Pocket

    Staying in the pocket has nothing to do with Warner. It’s a basic of most passing plays.

  36. By Tod on Oct 3, 2011 | Reply

    EVERY week I hear the announcers talking about Kolb’s eyes and how they lock on to a receiver and the DBs know exactly where the ball is going.

    Is anybody ever going to address this issue?

  37. By Rick on Oct 3, 2011 | Reply

    Hey at least we are consistant and nobody can doubt that lol.

  38. By iluvbugel on Oct 3, 2011 | Reply

    Three straight weeks of no effort with games on the line. I love this team but I’m very unhappy. There is abolutely no reason with under 5 minutes left up by 10 kicking off to the other team that they should then drive right down field and score a touchdown with 3 minutes still on the clock! Horrible! Where was the D on that drive!? It was like nobody was trying to stop them. Where was the pass rush? Where is the heart?! Where is the emotion?! One week-ok. Three straight weeks-no excuse! We SHOULD be 4-0!

  39. By GW on Oct 3, 2011 | Reply

    TOO MANY PENALTIES,cant finish games,sloppy play calling and bad time management point to the coaching staff in which go to the seem to me that this team is afraid of winning and not rebuilding they were in the sb 3 years ago i do believe if bill belechick and his staff coached the cards they will be a playoff contender because if your not playing up to par you sit.

  40. By GW on Oct 3, 2011 | Reply

    wow! the cards are 6-14 the past 2years and lost every game in their alternate jersey

  41. By Scott H on Oct 3, 2011 | Reply

    So many GREAT responses here!

    wnycardfan –

    Very well said. I don’t even want to hear about the damn fumble that wasn’t and I am glad to hear Whiz acknowledge that the game should not come down to something like that. Unfortuantely, he’s right. Win the damn game on your own. When you’re up by 10 late in the 4th quarter at home against a team that was ready to be beaten ( as the Giants were yesterday ), you’re either good enough to finish or you’re not. Period. Watching this game yesterday was like watching the game against the Vikings last year. Like watching a car crash in slow motion…you know what’s gonna happen and there’s nothing you can do about it.

    Which is what is so discouraging at this point. Here’s what happened in my house yesterday with the Cardinals up 27-17 with less that 5:00 to play – my 15 y/o daughter sees the score scrolling across the bottom of the screen as I’m watching another game and she’s all excited for me, thinking this is a win for the Cardinals. I just look at her and shake my head and say “They can still easily lose this game.” BECAUSE THAT’S EXACTLY WHAT I BELIEVED WAS GOING TO HAPPEN!!! She waves me off like I’m just being silly and she moves on. Then, they lose. Later that night, she asks “Did the Cardinals win, daddy”? And I just look at her and say “What did I tell you was going to happen?” She says “Oh my God, you have to be kidding me!” And I say “Nope. This is just what they do and I’m used to it.”

    It’s a lousy feeling when you expect your team to lose. It sucks when their is no sense of BELIEF that your team can win a game. When they were down 3 to the Seahawks, there was no sense of belief that they were gonna win that game. When they were ahead by 10 yesterday, there was no sense of belief that they were going to hold on for the win.

    And ya know what? There isn’t a team in the league so far that has looked more inept and / or hopeless than our next opponent, the Vikings. And I have no sense of belief that the Cardinals can win that one, either. Thank you, Cardinals – players, coaches, and front office – for this wonderful feeling. Last year, we had Derek Anderson and Bill Davis as scapegoats. Well, they’re gone and nothing has changed. Maybe this year, our scapegoats will be the people who are truly responsible. And as far as I’m concerned at this point, no one should be considered safe from the axe. NO ONE!!!

  42. By Rowlan on Oct 3, 2011 | Reply

    New Webster’s Dictionary

    def. INSANITY: watching the arizona cardinals week after week and year after year, and expecting to see DIFFERENT RESULTS.

    porter, haggans, lenon LATER

    acho, schofield, sturdivant NOW PLEASE. rather lose with our guys than castoffs!!!!!!

  43. By firewatch on Oct 3, 2011 | Reply

    We Missed Q – I liked your comments regarding the draft. I’m not sure if Whiz & staff are no good at drafting, or no good and developing the talent they draft, but your point is well taken. BTW didn’t DRC go to the pro-bowl? Kind of ironic that the only draft pick to go to the pro bowl was traded away.

  44. By TucsonTim on Oct 3, 2011 | Reply

    Did anyone ask about clock management? At the end of the first half we had 3 time outs, the ball on our 29 yd line, 3rd and one thanks to a Wells 9 yard rush, and a minute to play in the half. Why not take a time out? Discuss the play. What’s working (running with B Wells) and what’s not (Kolb looked very tentative, not stayng in the pocket etc). A first down there keeps them from scoring and maybe we move the ball to FG range. NY’s ability to strike quickly at the end of the first half was an omen of things to come.

    Our team played very well against a very good Giants team. No reason to hang our heads. Sure, Kolb could have made some better decisions, and my grand mother can pass rush better than Porter, but it was play calling, bad 4th quarter defensive schemes and poor clock management that cost us the game. That doesn’t mean Whiz needs to be fired. I’d just like to see him accept some responsibility.

  45. By Tx Cards fan on Oct 3, 2011 | Reply


    Do you have any idea how things would look with better red zone execution this season? I want to say the team is much more competitive than the 1-3 record would lead you to believe. To me it always seems like the team drives well but is one play away from 3 to 6 points almost every time they get inside the 20. Maybe I am over thinking it but when your 3 losses are by 1, 3, and 4 points, all it would take is getting the ball in the end zone 1 more time a game when they have the chance or even just getting a field goal. I guess I’m just looking for the half full of 3 strait L’s.

  46. By Chris on Oct 3, 2011 | Reply

    RE: firewatch & DRC

    Now, I’m not getting down on DRC.. he has a god given talent and ability but, he struggles to use it well. He is a nickle corner in Philly and hasn’t really done that much. So far, the trade for Kolb to me appears to be about even. If Kolb can learn the system and perform better.. then the trade favors Arizona to me. Just my opinion.

  47. By cdacardfan on Oct 3, 2011 | Reply

    At least we are putting points on the board witch is something we didnt do last year. I would like to see Horton come down from his perch and pump this defense up and give them face to face instructions. Seems like we could have used it last few games.

    still with ya Cards

  48. By Rugbymuffin on Oct 3, 2011 | Reply

    Any reason the full press conferences are no longer posted on the website ?

  49. By Darren Urban on Oct 3, 2011 | Reply

    Rugby muffin –

    RE: pressers

    Full audio can be found on the “Photo and Video” tab on the homepage. Then go to “press conference audio.”

  50. By Tx Cards fan on Oct 3, 2011 | Reply

    Afew thoughts for the group;

    If you ask me, this year will be a growth and rebuilding year. The Cardinals have a new DC, QB, 5 new defensive starters, 8 new offensive starters, and no off season. So, it’s easy to see with all the new pieces things will be slow and behind what everyone expects. I myself wanted 9 to 10 wins before the preseason started but expected at least 8 wins. Now I see the team is most likely a 5-11 or 6-10 team this year. However, I will say this year they will be a good 5 or 6-win team if there is such a thing.

    I think you have to take the time to understand how truly bad a 5-win team the Cardinals really were last year. The Cardinals won 3 of their 5 games last year by 4 points or less, and another game by 10 points. So you can see with some bad luck or a missed play here or there, they are a 1 or 2-win team. All the while, being the last place team in the worst division in the NFL. As you can see they portray a very bad 5-win team.

    Last year the Bills only had 4 wins, but they had 5 losses by 5 points or less, and 7 losses of 10 points or less. A little luck here or there and the Bills could have been a 9-win team last year. This off season the Bills made very little major moves. This year they jump off to a 4-0 start and look very much like the real deal. So one might say they could portray a good 4-12 team last year.

    You might think it is way too early to look to next year and your right. But for me, as long as the team is competitive and improving every week I’ll deal with a “good” 5, 6 or 7-win team this year for the pay off next year. Add a player here and there and a full year to gel as a team and I think we could be next year’s Bills. Trust me I’m not saying it won’t be painful and drive me (and everyone else) insane in the mean time, but just as a player has to learn to play a position a team has to learn how to win a game as a team. With that there will be a lot of close games that don’t go your way, and yes sometime 3 in a row.

  51. By cheesebeef on Oct 3, 2011 | Reply


    How could Wiz say Bridges did “an OK” job when compared to the “solid” job Keith apparently has done this season where he’s been atrocious? And are you inferring that if Keith is healthy next week, he’ll be BACK in the lineup even though the offense was much better with Bridges in there?


  52. By Darren Urban on Oct 3, 2011 | Reply

    Cheese –

    RE: RT

    I don’t know what is going to happen.

  53. By Cert 33 on Oct 3, 2011 | Reply

    Upper management paid the big bucks and put the talent on this team. Now it’s going to be a struggle to equal last years pathetic record until Whiz and his staff get canned in the off-season. The sad part is the proven winners available like Jeff Fisher will probably be snatched up by then.

  54. By georgiebird on Oct 3, 2011 | Reply

    I root for both the baseball Cardinals and the Football Cardinals- what a difference!
    Over a 50 year period, the baseball team almost always seems to over-achieve under the watchful eyes of some great managers like Schoedienst, Herzog and LaRussa.
    During the same period, the Football team almost always seems to under-achieve under the clueless eyes of Hanifan, Stallings,Tobin, Ryan, McGinnis, Green and now Whiz.
    It’s very clear to me what’s going on.

  55. By suspence716 on Oct 3, 2011 | Reply

    I have told u to talk to Rod Graves about picking up Randy Moss, Terrell Owens, and Benny Sapp. While ur at it also mention Leonard Davis. I realize they will only have like an NFL lockout years worth of catching up…. But the team i see on the field hasn’t caught on anyway, so what could hurt? Don’t we want to WIN???!!!!!!!! Hello, this is simple! Go sign these players n lets go! Does Michael Bidwell ever read this? HELLO MICHAEL, are u there??? Don’t be like ur dad, lets be winners already. Don’t you remember how awesome it was winning the NFC championship? Don’t u know what that meant? It meant we were the BEST out of a whole conference of teams, n it was some narly fun ride!!! Lets do it again guy, go sign some big names n lets win again…. Forget this horse n pony show u keep putting on the field, its disgusting!!!!!

  56. By suspence716 on Oct 3, 2011 | Reply

    P.S. Get Rid of Michael Adams… ya ya i realize whiz really likes mighty mouses attitude n effort, especially during practice, but have u ever seen him on film during the game? 27 is not an NFL caliber football player. Replace him with Benny Sapp already!

  57. By Bay Area Bad Boy on Oct 3, 2011 | Reply

    We are looking better. Just need the ball to bounce our way now. We dominated the Giants so I am looking forward to the rest of the season. We still have a chance. It’s only the 1st quarter of the season. and as we all know as Cardinal fans, “ITS NOT HOW YOU START, ITS HOW YOU FINISH” We haven’t finished yet.. 12 games to go. The Vikings are next. So lets let the Giants game go and move forward.

  58. By Alex Mullane on Oct 3, 2011 | Reply


    has whiz said anything on the rationale for not calling a timeout on that 4th down play. i think they could have gotten that 1st down if they had had time to come up with a good play, but thats just my opinion

  59. By Darren Urban on Oct 3, 2011 | Reply

    Alex –

    RE: timeout

    It wasn’t asked. My guess would be they wouldnt have called a different play (without hindsight, of course).

  60. By Blake on Oct 3, 2011 | Reply

    I am not going to even waste my time rambleing about the disgust i have with this team ,WE ARE SO PREDICTABLE its PATHETIC same stupid play on both offense and defense and by the way is it something with the number 75 because both Leonard Davis and Levi Brown have been a joke as Cardinals URGGGG frustration Ken Whisenhunt LET ME TELL YOU ABOUT FRUSTRATION !!!!!!( after 41 years of FAITHFUL following i am finally coming to the realization that i need to exorsise this team from my soul ) but i can tell you this ,the Vikings are licking their chops waiting for the Cardinals to come to town this sunday so once again we can make someone look good. Just as a side note i expect the Vikings to start Christian Ponder ( mind you a qb we were looking at in the draft ) and if history is any indication he will have a great game and look like a future hall of famer because thats what the Cardinals DO they make everyone ELSE look good.

  61. By Matthew on Oct 3, 2011 | Reply

    I am officially no longer a cardinals fan. I have supported this team, put my faith in this team, and believed in this team for to long. Even before the superbowl i had so much faith in the Cardinals and i am not a bandwagon fan from 2008. I was a fan of the pat tillman and Jake Plummer days. However nothing has changed one dang bit since those days. We are still losing close games, we are still losing games that should be automatic wins, and we are certainly nowhere near a division title to even say the least. Cardinal fan 23 years and not counting.

  62. By CrazyLady25 on Oct 3, 2011 | Reply


    As much as I would have liked for it to be different, the ball was down. Cruz had given up, and was getting up to go back to the Giants’ huddle. According to the what the NFL rules clearly state, the ball was dead. No fumble.

  63. By Nathan on Oct 3, 2011 | Reply

    Here’s the kicker guys. We started 2-2 last year under Anderson and they switched to Max Hall. That didn’t turn out so well. Although the Defense go us past the Saints. I say we stick with Kolb give him 2 more back to back losses and from there you throw in Skelton. Bartel is okay, but he’s old; he’s not exactly the plan to develope the franchise quarterback. I’d say overall Skelton would be better than Kolb, Kolb looks like Big Ben holding onto the ball in the pocket just without talented recievers to get open on broken plays and without the ability to break sacks and make something happen. So in other words the poor man’s Big Ben. Which makes sense that the Cardinals are just becoming the poor man’s Steelers anyways i guess.

  64. By elimatees on Oct 3, 2011 | Reply

    Thanks for the opinion regarding the ground/fumble rule.
    Something I’ve noticed a few times this year: Andre Roberts is a terrible blocker. He lines up in a tight slot position and can’t stop the defender across him from chasing down the play from behind, or goes in motion only to do nothing to slow the DE or OLB. Perhaps Doucet should be doing that job.

  65. By Brandon LA on Oct 3, 2011 | Reply

    I can’t get over this Wells touch! The one with the penalty and dudes helmet comes off. I could re-watch him running over the giants on the goal line all night. Beanie is practically parallel with the ground, freakin’ horizontal!!

  66. By Brian R. on Oct 3, 2011 | Reply

    Cardinals defense showed improvement. Kevin Kolb show very little, any if all. He needs to stop feeling so panicky, and get my comfortable. I like the guy, but he need some more practice with this Cardinals offense. The o-line needs to step it up and allow him even more time.

  67. By Chris on Oct 3, 2011 | Reply

    I have been a Cardinals fan since 1984. My years in High school went like this with my trusty Cardinals jacket on “Hey Cardinals suck! hahaha”.
    It of course came from Cowboys and 49ers at the time, since they were the powerhouses at the time.
    I stuck with them no matter what it would have been easy to put on a 49ers or Cowboys Jersey, and give up with the losing I didn’t.
    When they won Their first Playoff game since I had been Alive in 1998 against the “evil” Cowboys, felt like the world lifted off my Shoulders.
    Point is took me awhile to get over the Superbowl loss.
    Came so close and we lost it, in much the same way we lost the last three games.
    I also speak from experience, in saying Cardinals on average have the most wishy washy fans in the NFL.
    I was at many a cowboy game at sun devil stadium, and personally see many people wearing Cardinal jerseys under their Cowboys Jersey, when the Cardinals did win they would take off the Cowboys Jersey and pretend to be a Cardinals fan or we were just plain out numbered 3 to 1.
    I am not saying all fans are, not even most, just about half.
    You guys complaining about Whiz, Kolb, exclaiming how we traded the wrong running back are simply idiots and complainers.
    Do you know anything about the game at all? No wonder the press and players on average think fans are so stupid.
    Real Fans have patience, Kolb needs time as does this team, there are many new faces.
    It takes around 16 games under a system before you can really judge a QB, I think The Cardinals may be done this year but I will still support this team and always will.
    Remember that guy Kurt Warner? I remember when Whiz picked him to Start over Matt Leinart.
    People were complaining big time, much like they are now, calling out for Whiz’s head, exclaiming how Kurt Warner was washed up how Matt was our “Future”.Then Superbowl happened.
    Let the season end, even if no playoffs happen this year, next year we will be toast of the NFC go 11-5 and make a Superbowl push.
    Then all you pretender Cardinal fans out there can make others believe you have been a fan all along. How is the bandwagon treating you lately?
    Then I get to hear my least favorite comment of all time “Be honest with me now, you just Bought that Cardinals hat this year.” or “I have never met a Cardinals fan before.”
    Keep up the good work Darren.

  68. By Old Man Riva on Oct 4, 2011 | Reply

    If you look carefully at the remaining games, there is a very good chance the Cards will end up 7-9 or 8-8. I seriously doubt they will be able to finish above .500 after the way the first 4 games have gone (obviously we should be 4-0). The team doesn’t have enough depth to weather any key injuries (like the Rams) that may occur. Plus the difficulty of the remaining schedule (Steelers, Ravens, Eagles, Cowboys, etc…) coupled with having to try and break in a brand new qb, oc and dc in a short period of time will work against them the rest of the year. If they do finish 7-9 or 8-8 it should be considered a successful season and then 2012 will be dynamite! GO BIG RED!

  69. By Eric on Oct 4, 2011 | Reply

    The good: Beanie, finally got his chance and look what happened

    The bad: not giving Beanie the ball on SEVERAL short yardage plays. Also, man coverage on our CB’s, they will suffer all year if they don’t tighten it up. They need to be in the WR’s face, on the line, period.

    The Ugly: passing D, coaching, coaching, coaching, and WHAT GENIOUS GOT RID OF GRAHM? Our punter sucks, period.

  70. By georgiebird on Oct 4, 2011 | Reply

    Point #1–Linebacker has ALWAYS been a problem with the Cardinals. I don’t think but one or two players has made the Pro Bowl in 50 years-honestly, and EJ Junior was put in one year as the “token” Cardinal; Junior was a big diappointment.
    Point #2–The 3-4 defense puts a premium on monster LB play.

    Hello! Hello! is anybody home???

  71. By Rodgerscromartie17 on Oct 4, 2011 | Reply

    You all need to face the fact, I myself have asked about this many many times and the answer is always the same, the Cards are never going to sign big name FA’s to this team, no matter how good they are. This team like young unproven players, they would rather not have “divas” in the locker room who can make us plays, thats why our passing game sucks, no WR’s to take Fitz out of double coverage

  72. By B on Oct 4, 2011 | Reply

    We couldn’t protect the lead in the Super Bowl,we still can’t protect a lead now.

    Is it safe to say Coach Whis is not all the great of a coach,and even more credit should be given to Kurt Warner?


  73. By Az in Canada on Oct 4, 2011 | Reply

    I felt sick after watching that game against the giants. When we went up by 10, I was happy for about 5 seconds before i realized that there was a good chance that we were gonna blow it. That’s probably the worst feeling that a fan can have. Maybe second only to the feeling of when it actually happens. Call me crazy but I think we’ve got a good chance against the vikings. I think they’ve gotta be feeling just about as deflated as most of us are right now. However, it’s clear that we have potential, which can’t be said for them at the moment. For that reason I believe we have a psychological advantage going into minny. And a win going into a bye week coupled with a tough week 5 for the rest of the division (save for the rams who have a bye) is just what I think the cards need to get back on track. We can still get this done.

  74. By Jahstone on Oct 4, 2011 | Reply

    Great to see so many fans involved in the chat. We have sold out all of our home games and have more fans now than ever in the past. If we make the playoffs this season, that would start a new norm. Just look at our history…let us hope to start some new trends.

    This is a new system and a locked-out off season. Don’t panic until week 9.

    Stay positive and remember….it’s only sports 🙂

  75. By Zach on Oct 4, 2011 | Reply

    To Georgiebird – why are you commenting on our LB’s? Our middle LB’s are playing great, Washington is a stud and Lenon is playing very well. Stewart is coming along slowly but we have no issues stopping the run. We need a better rush LB and that is it. Get Schofield in there are try him out. Our coverage needs to improve and 1 rush LB and our defense will be top notch!
    Our front 7 is playing very well – lots of sacks and stopping the run game! Passing, special teams, and coverage need to step up

  76. By steve on Oct 4, 2011 | Reply

    I have to agree with many of the aforementioned comments –coach Whisenhunt’s calm demeanor is not what is needed now –yes we alll agree it shouldn’t have come to that –but the Giants can say if we didnt fumble 2 times within our own twenty then we wouldn’t have needed the comeback .. I think anger and emotion is needed from Whisenhunt –not this placid demeanor –rip the officials!!!! I am sure there will be a fine BUT if it allows the officials to maybe take notice and throw Arizona a call down the road and allows ‘us’ to get a win –maybe it saves Whisenhunt’s job.. Also I know the VP of officials stood behind there refs and said they made the right call === OF COURSE THEY ARE GOING TO SAY THAT!!!! What do you expect them to say we blew the call and cost Arizona a game, maybe a playoff birth, playoff game lots of money lost!!! I am angry about this — I really am, I am sure Whisenhunt is, so blow off some steam— I am sure it will help in the long run — and lets face it –maybe even saving this season and his job!!!

  77. By georgiebird on Oct 4, 2011 | Reply

    Hello Zach- there are 4 linebackers in a 3-4.
    Washington is playing OK-he is not a premier LB at this time but the potential is there.
    Lenon at age 33 should be a backup
    Porter and Haggans are horrible at this stage of their careers.
    On a scale of 1-10; my LB rating is a 4; in a 3-4 defense it’s necessary for the LBs to play at a level above 8.5.
    But Zach, I’m glad to see you’re drinking the kool-aid.

  78. By clssylssy on Oct 4, 2011 | Reply

    I thought Coach Whisenhunt handled the “press conference” after the game with great class. This “fumble that wasn’t” issue has become a dominate story this week with just about everyone weighing in including Coach Sean Payton and various sports analysts including Tony Dungy, all of whom are more qualified and knowledgeable about the subject than fans. I don’t know why the Cards “fans” are so intent on criticizing everything our team does. They played a good game against the Giants, they played much better than anyone anticipated against the Redskins and will have another opportunity to play the Seahawks on our home ground. We aren’t winning but we are playing well enough to begin earning some respect.As long as there are discretionary calls that are unchallengable there is going to be human error and an opportunity for corruption. It would be in everybody’s best interest for the NFL to overhaul their rulebook and eliminate some of these dumb rules and develop a system for review and appeal. BAD RULE, BAD CALL….GOOD JOB COACH WHISENHUNT!

  79. By jstn on Oct 4, 2011 | Reply

    another game where refs and the media are against the cards, feeling like we lost even before the game ever starts. horriable year. Dumb dumb dumb officiating this year. Cards fan should all write to the officiating league and tell them to straighten up, stop hiring highschool drop outs.

  80. By Scott H on Oct 4, 2011 | Reply

    Sorry, folks, but “good” games still go in the loss column when the other team scores more points. Love how people look forward to the games ahead when the losses just keep piling up behind us. Why should we look forward to playing the Seahawks again when we just held them to 13 points in their house and still couldn’t win the game??? The Seahawks were bad last year and they still came into our house and laid it on us. While I’d rather not be so “negative”, I just don’t see what has changed since then. I’ll believe this team can win when they start winning. I’ve already been through a couple of decades of playing “good” games and “close” games that we would always lose en route to one losing season after another. So, I’m not interested in giving points for “good” games. Save it. Winning is what matters.

  81. By NJAZCardsFan on Oct 4, 2011 | Reply

    Given the opportunity will the Cards draft Andrew Luck? We are in the running now….
    BTW- I have already given up on this season. If Whiz didn’t change his shirt, the same press conference tape could be used every week from now on…..

  82. By clssylssy on Oct 5, 2011 | Reply

    Geez,,,at least we can a be thankful we don’t have Tony Romo for a QB, and you don’t hear Dallas fans wailing and devaluing everything about their team…to the contrary! It seems we aren’t the only team this year with problems…Dallas, Denver, Philly, St.Louis,Miami,Jacksonville,Kansas City, Indianapolis, Minnesota…getting my drift?
    I sometimes wonder if our fans tell their kids that winning is what matters , irregardless of how they play the game??

  83. By Cert 33 on Oct 5, 2011 | Reply

    The defense has always been pretty good. For three and a half quarters. No surprise there, same defense that choked up the Super Bowl, the big lead in the Packer playoff game, etc… It’s Whiz & the staff guys. He’s just another Bill Callahan. Remember him? Everyone said he was an offensive genius, great coach, blah blah etc… Then his 39 year old MVP QB Rich Gannon went and retired on him shortly after a Super Bowl appearance and guess what? Turned out Callahan couldn’t win a game witout Gannon if his life depended on it (Is this starting to sound familiar?) As a matter of fact, after Al Davis figured it out and gave him his walking papers, it turned out Callahan couldn’t even win on the college football level. Bidwell is a little slower to see it but he will. Remember, we are just a single, great individual effort on a punt return from being 0-4. We will end up 5-11, maybe 6-10 tops.

  84. By Scott H on Oct 5, 2011 | Reply

    clssylssy –

    With all due respect, what I tell my kids about their efforts and / or the importance of winning has nothing to do with professional atheletes. And in regard to the problems of other teams, yes, I’m well aware that. Doesn’t matter. Do YOU tell YOUR kids that if other kids aren’t playing very well, then it’s OK for them to do the same???

    I invest myself in THIS team. Therefore, I take no comfort in how other teams are struggling. I prefer to look at teams like the Lions and Bills who are heading in the right direction. I’d rather look at winning teams and see that as something to aspire to than look at losing teams and say “Well, at least we’re not the only ones.”

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