Thoughts in the wake of Red-White

Posted by Darren Urban on July 28, 2012 – 9:35 pm

The first week is over, and what stuck with me after today’s Red-White practice (while I thought about it on my drive home to see the family) was John Skelton’s comment that there was a long way to go. Cliche, sure. But it’s truth. Take away walkthroughs, which are limited in their value, and the Cards had exactly three practices before today. Did the offense or the quarterbacks wow today? No. But we’re a week away from the first of five preseason games. There’s a long, long way to go.

— I know everyone wants to make assessments of Skelton and Kevin Kolb after today. Coach Ken Whisenhunt even said Friday he expected that to happen. But Whiz also said today there would be no snap judgements. He talked about dropped passes, about missed assignments. Bottom line, and I’m sure I’m sounding like a broken record, but this will come down to preseason games. Something tells me no one is going to reference Red-White whenever the regular-season starter is named.

— I thought Michael Floyd looked pretty good today. It’s early, but that would be nice to have him emerge. He made a couple of catches and you can see why his big body works in tight coverage, blocking out the defensive back.

— Cornerback A.J. Jefferson got a lot of action today. He gave up some catches but made some other plays. He’s intriguing. He’s kind of been lost in the CB discussion with William Gay signing and Greg Toler coming back and Jamell Fleming getting drafted.

— With the NFL in the middle of using replacement officials while contract negotiations go on with the regular officials, one possible replacement would be a woman, who was working today’s Red-White practice. I didn’t get her name, but Mike Jurecki got a picture.

— The abductor injury to running back Javarris James could cause some roster movement. It’s not that I thought James necessarily was going to make the roster, but James now won’t play against the Saints in all probability, and Beanie Wells was already going to miss that game. I’m not sure they’d want to use Ryan Williams either, given their desire to be conservative. So that leaves just LaRod Stephens-Howling, Alfonso Smith and William Powell. Not that Powell can’t do it — remember, when the Cards lost Williams and wanted to protect Wells last year, Powell had an astounding 29 carries in the final preseason game (and then was cut the next day.)

— A crowd of 14,500. Simply amazing. I ran into former Cardinals wide receiver and kickoff returner MarTay Jenkins (1999-2002) who looked over the throng for autographs and said, “Damn, it was never like this for us!” Which I can say since I was covering the team back then, it wasn’t.

— Finally, there seemed to be a difference of opinion between Williams and Patrick Peterson about whether Peterson would have made the tackle on Williams during his 44-yard run. I managed to get a shot of the moment of contact. You make the call.

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29 Responses to “Thoughts in the wake of Red-White”

  1. By Jason Zumwalt on Jul 28, 2012 | Reply

    Peterson missed. Barely.

    Looking forward to the Saints game, but am really looking forward to hearing about the practice with The Chiefs. I expect some players to step it up and emerge. According to Wolfley practicing with another team is like game speed times two.

    Keep up the great work!


  2. By Gag$ on Jul 28, 2012 | Reply

    Darren, im sure its very very tought to keep up with everyone during camp and im sure yu can grow very annoyed of questions like this but,

    how has Justin Bethel looked so far through camp and the red-white? thanks again!

  3. By Darren Urban on Jul 28, 2012 | Reply

    Gags –

    RE: Bethel

    Haven’t noticed him a ton. Running third team right now.

  4. By Logan Cooper on Jul 28, 2012 | Reply

    This was the first time in 3 years I haven’t made it up there. I was bummed about it but there is always next year.

    I remember going to training camp the beginning of the 08′ year. 100-150 people max and that’s probably pushing it. I’m not huge into asking players for autographs but I was able to chat with multiple players in the most casual setting as they were walking back from practice. My nephews were able to get a slew of signatures and that day, still highlights their greatest memories.I am happy that we have this many “fans” now and hope that we can progress to becoming a fan city similar in nature to packers, steelers type.

    How did Fleming and Massie look?
    Also, if that atrocious comeback route by Floyd is any indication of the player, yikes, we are in big trouble. Yes, I will judge him and his success on that one route. 🙂

  5. By Darren Urban on Jul 29, 2012 | Reply

    Logan —

    RE: Massie and Fleming

    To be honest, I didn’t focus on either. It’s early.

  6. By AndyStandsUp on Jul 28, 2012 | Reply

    Multitude of queries:
    With the James injury, maybe Chester Taylor brought back?
    Rumor about players boycotting HOF game with replacement refs despite the CBA saying strikes are a no go?
    Ronald Talley bar room scuffle more fact than fiction?
    Possibility NAU starts to charge for parking and/or admission to allieviate the Flag crowd? (It’s just getting past the point of being manageable.)
    Kent Somers possible QB to Fitz really that unthinkable?

    Like you said Darren. LONG way to go, but a short time to get there.

  7. By Darren Urban on Jul 29, 2012 | Reply

    AndyStands –

    RE: questions

    1) No. Taylor is done.
    2) No way players walk.
    3) No idea on Talley, but it does seem kinda sketchy to me.
    4) Don’t see it happening. Understand frustration, but I don’t see a charge.
    5) Clearly you’ve never seen Kent try to throw, especially when blitzed.

  8. By Christo on Jul 29, 2012 | Reply

    This QB “competition” is a terrible waste of limited resources. Kolb in addition to being the better statistical QB last year, also is the one we have everything invested in. Valuable reps are being wasted. Skelton is the back up, the back up that will probably play after Kolb gets crushed by our pathetic OL that again did not get addressed this off season.

    If we go under .500 this year does Whisenhunt get shown the door? Or do we just get an Assistant iin who can actually evaluate QB and OL talent?

    12 and 20 in our last 32 games Birdgang.

  9. By clssylssy on Jul 29, 2012 | Reply

    I’m really enjoying your articles on some of the young newer players that are going to be playing such a big role to the success of the Card’s this season. I’m a big TE fan and find Rob Housler particularly exciting to watch but am a little nervous as it seems we are a bit thin in some areas. Would have LOVED to see us pick up a good pass rusher but will continue to put my faith in Coach Whiz and cross my fingers. I’m getting REALLY tired of having the QB controversy dominate the news and note that we are not the only team with a QB competition going on in training camp. I see that the Seahawks are #1 with their QB competition and feel that we have a much better talent pool if we can just have a decent and functional player in theQB. I think we all know there will be no Drew Brees or Ben Rothinsberger leading our offense so am counting on Ray Horton and the guys on defense. Looking forward to the HOF Game and the scrimmage with the Chiefs to get our young players use to playing on a bigger stage with the pace amped up a bit. I SEE THE RED SEA RISING & SMELL FOOTBALL IN THE AIR! GO CARDS!

  10. By hummer53 on Jul 29, 2012 | Reply

    I have to take exception to the folks saying there were just a couple hundred people at the practices years ago. I have been going since 1988. Yes the Mondays, Tuesdays days there were maybe 500-700 there. But on Friday’s there would be around a thousand or two. And the Red/White would have 5 or 6 thousand or so. Yes even in the dark days a lot of hard core fans would get out of the heat to see the Saturday scrimmages. Would have real interesting to see how many would have been there yesterday if Peyton Manning would have come here. That would have been crazy.

  11. By Andy M on Jul 29, 2012 | Reply

    Christo–in terms of statistics; the reason so many fans are intrigued with Skelton, is that he consistently found a way to win (while Kolb did not) and unless you are a statistics or fantasy geek, there is one statistic that trumps all others. This argument about the Kolb “investment” is ridiculous. Any savvy businessman will tell you that “sunk costs are irrelevant”. It is what they teach MBA’s in the first day. The Cardinals make there best guesses when they invest in players. Sometimes it works and sometimes it doesn’t, but nobody should be played because they negotiated a big contract.

    Nonetheless, Kolb might well win the competition. If he does, he will have earned it and the team will be better for the competition. I am pulling for both guys.

    The rest of you negative comments seem premature. Why don’t you wait until the team loses a few games before getting sour.

  12. By Richard S. on Jul 29, 2012 | Reply

    What struck me is Mr. Bidwill’s claim that he gave money to the Republican party strictly because of jobs. If that is the case why do the Cardinal trinkets on sale say “Made in China”. I think Mr. Bidwill gave money to the Republicans purely out of greed so rich people can keep their money. May your wannabe Republican Congressman kicker miss far wide right in a key game. Former Cardinal fan. Bidwil gave his money to the Republicans for the same reason he moved from Missouri, pure greed.

  13. By tacticalcardinal on Jul 29, 2012 | Reply

    My family and I attended for the first time and it was great.. What was with the interception by Clark Haggans, he threw the ball to a fan which we all thought was Awesome!! And then a ball guy made him give it back.. (insert a BOO here!). But it was a great time anyway!! GO CARDINALS!!

  14. By iammattyoung on Jul 29, 2012 | Reply

    I know it’s only been a week of training camp, but here are a couple of predictions for the season:

    1. Opposing offenses sleep on Sam Acho, and he picks up where he left off last season. He ends up leading the team in sacks with more than 10.

    2. Kevin Kolb wins the QB job — and deserves it. I don’t know why, but I just feel it. Despite all the criticism and doubt, despite all the love for John Skelton, Kolb has kept his mouth shut and keeps on working. I think he gets in there and shows us something.

  15. By iammattyoung on Jul 29, 2012 | Reply

    Also, I agree with Christo 95% (5% ambiguity, because I’m not certain Kolb is the guy you go with). Competition is great, but with so little time to prepare, you have to pick your QB and give him all the 1st team reps. You’re doing neither guy any favors by ultimately giving whoever the starter is only half of the reps he needs to prepare for the season.

    How to choose which guy is your starter? I don’t know, but I’d look at who put in the most work over the offseason. Maybe give them a timed written exam on the playbook and evaluate accuracy and footwork, then go with the guy who has the best composite score.

  16. By cardsalltheway on Jul 29, 2012 | Reply

    “12 and 20 in our last 32 games Birdgang.”

    Which is why only the last 8 games of 2011 have been the only focus by all the you know who. NFL camps and preseason is boring. Bring on the Seahawks Sunday, September 09, @ 1:15 PM

  17. By azfancolo on Jul 29, 2012 | Reply

    Just 168 hours to go til the Hall Of Fame game! @ hummer53 I remember going from 97 to 02 I would say you are about right give or take it did seem less though!

  18. By whythecardinals on Jul 29, 2012 | Reply

    I really trust Coach Whisenhunt, and I think Kevin Kolb got thrown to the wolves last year with the “lock-out” and trade restrictions… no matter. I am not a fan of either, qb, just a guy who loves the Cardinals… Just wondering: were Kevin’s interceptions because he was trying to throw a “tight window” or were they just bad throws?
    PS… from SC and The Citadel, would love to know more abour Andre Roberts and Justin Bethel…

  19. By whythecardinals on Jul 29, 2012 | Reply

    I’m not sure if this is going to be a duplicate post because of “log in” stuff… darren, been a fan since ’74, maybe one of 5 in the state of SC… with Kevin Kolb, were the INTs crappy passes or was he trying a tight “window?” and finally, Citadel graduate, how’s Andre Roberts doing and dying to know more about Justin Bethel (my son is going to his alumni to play soccer)… that also expains 3 other fans in SC… (PS{ you do a great job) LET’s WIN!

  20. By Darren Urban on Jul 29, 2012 | Reply

    whythecardinals —

    RE: Roberts/Bethel

    I think Roberts is in a good place in his third season. We’ll see how that plays out. So early for Bethel. He’s raw. Got a way to go.

  21. By Cactus jeff on Jul 29, 2012 | Reply

    Please no response to Richard S, let’s talk football. Darren, any options in FA for backup RB? Happy to hear Floyd is showing potential.

  22. By Darren Urban on Jul 30, 2012 | Reply

    Cactus —

    RE: RB

    If Beanie comes back as everyone keeps saying they expect, not sure if they will get anyone. Good question in the short term though.

  23. By mike (AZcatsNcards) on Jul 30, 2012 | Reply


    Re: QB “competition” is a terrible waste

    DISAGREE! I know the D got better later in the season but I wan’t the QB who is going to be out there 16 games more likely. ALSO, I don’t care about experience or stats or anything else, I want the QB who has the players attention and has them willing to make that play when their total spent. AND the QB who is going to put a W on the scoreboard/ record. IDC if that person is Bartel and we pay Skelton and Kolb the same amount of $. I just want our QB to get it done. You failed to mention all of Skelton’s good attributes so I’ll name a few: He’ll stay in the pocket and wait that extra second for the WR even though he knows he’s going to get hit (KOLB WAS SCARED OF THE POCKET), At this point I see more upside to Skelton then Kolb who has had many more camps n different coaches working with him, Skelton isn’t going to fake a concussion due to him sliding or diving and his head hitting the ground (even when some fans are getting restless in the stadium and frustrated) . Skelton has less pressure and has shown it works in his advantage and I believe even if he is named the starter he will be able to handle everything.
    I see where your coming from and I would agree but with 5 preseason games and both having started last season, I think this is as good as any year to have a QB competition.
    *Any thoughts Darren?*

  24. By clssylssy on Jul 30, 2012 | Reply

    REALLY. REALlY sick of all the TIRED excuses made for Kolb. I have to wonder if he isn’t a little embarrassed too. The fact is we were losing games with him last season until John “The Closer”Skelton came in and brought with him some “intangibles” the team didn’t have under Kolb speaks or screams, volumes. Yes, our defense was coming together in the end however, it was Skelton’s tenancity that pushed us over the goal line in those late wins. There is a reason that Skelton is winning the competition in the locker room–there are no stats for leadership. Whoever “wins” as starter is going to have their work cut out for them in proving they are “the guy” as the win over the Seahawks is crucial. And Darren, since when is this a forum for talking politics…thought it was forbidden in the guidelines; it’s REALLY tacky to attack Mr. Bidwell for his political affiliation…seems a little off point!

  25. By Darren Urban on Jul 30, 2012 | Reply

    clssy —

    RE: Bidwill comment

    I was willing to let him say his peace, but that’s all he got.

  26. By Dave Chaney on Jul 30, 2012 | Reply

    It’s very cool to see the fan support for this team. Obviously there has not been a lot to get excited about over the years which makes the potential of this team very intriguing to the fans and they are showing it. In a way, Skelton reminds me of Tim Tebow (on the field that is). He doesn’t have the consistency a QB needs to win the Super Bowl, but he will find a way to win games in a somewhat unconventional manner. Bottom line to that is it makes him not the QB of the future, but a perennial backup. Not saying Kolb is the QB of the future, just that he seems to have more consistency in his game. Whether he can stay healthy is another question mark. I really wish the Cards weren’t in the HOF game so they had another week to prepare, but that’s life in the NFL.

  27. By Shawn from PA on Jul 30, 2012 | Reply

    GIVE LAROD THE BALL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  28. By Bob-O on Jul 30, 2012 | Reply

    Richard S….. ???? did Mr. Bidwell disclose the matters of his heart to you while writing said checks? . the moment we think we think we’re humble and have humility we take pride in that and BAM! it starts to work against you. This frame of mind has been long forgotten by many but not all…The economy of the blessing is between the two or more parties involved not the stand in (money) so easily we focus on the stand in and give money a magical realm that it cannot possibly live up to. Adub’s got it right :o) …. just found your comment interesting is all.

  29. By Eazy E on Aug 4, 2012 | Reply

    Naw Patrick!

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