Seahawks aftermath

Posted by Darren Urban on December 9, 2012 – 9:15 pm

Not even sure where to start. Winning in Seattle is rare. But to see it derail like that? I don’t know what is next. Coach Ken Whisenhunt said he hasn’t talked to anyone about his job situation. I don’t expect any drastic changes, not so close to the end of the season, but I haven’t talked to anyone about it either. In the meantime, the Cards have back-to-back home games to try and find a victory.

“Just everybody is really just playing for their pride at the end of the day,” defensive tackle Darnell Dockett said. “It’s going to take a lot of bonding for everybody to come together and win these last three games.”

— If Kevin Kolb doesn’t come back – and judging by how Kolb talked last week about his circumstances, that seems like a long shot – I’m not sure who Whisenhunt turns to at quarterback for the Lions game. The way both John Skelton and Ryan Lindley are playing, neither is an obvious option.

— The Cardinals were a plus-seven in turnover ratio coming into the game. After an eight-turnover game (and getting only one, the Patrick Peterson pick), the Cards are back to even.

— Dockett didn’t start as part of his punishment following the incident at the end of the New York game. He played, but not nearly as much as he normally would. Dockett was credited with a pair of assists and a quarterback hit. David Carter started in his place.

— No part of the Cardinals played well but Marshawn Lynch went off for 128 yards and three touchdowns on just 11 carries. Robert Turbin added 108 rushing yards himself on 20 carries. The run defense hasn’t been good enough but to surrender 284 yards on the ground is impossible to overcome.

— The Seahawks threw the ball deep on fourth and long late in the game and again later. Dockett said he was “surprised” but Whisenhunt wasn’t going there. “I have no comment on that, other than to say it’s our job to stop it.”

— The way the game went, I don’t think the Cards come out ahead regardless, but would things have been better had Skelton connected with Larry Fitzgerald on the first drive (pictured below) and not have it been an interception? The Cards had actually been successful on a couple of pass plays right before that. Then it turns into a turnover and … we all know the rest.

There is no analysis here, really. It was obviously the low point of this season and since Whisenhunt arrived. No one is arguing that. We will wait to see how the week goes.


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120 Responses to “Seahawks aftermath”

  1. By Fan in Chi Town on Dec 9, 2012 | Reply

    This season is beyond sad and now just hilarious.

  2. By Mike L on Dec 9, 2012 | Reply

    Darren, at some point there needs to be some accountability on Graves (lack of) performance. Whiz takes all the heat and I don’t think that’s fair, honestly. OL has been THE weakness of this team for as long as I can remember. Yes Whiz does have personnel input, but until I hear that Whiz actually calls the shots, it’s Graves neck on the chopping block.

  3. By Carlo Milano on Dec 9, 2012 | Reply

    I think qbs are awfull . But do u think is the only reason this team is ineffective offensivly? Whiz frustrated about qbs, ok but he didnt draft them?he should take some blame instead of giving it just to others,why all this people from sports when they took the Low level are not able to resign. They are already rich why they are so tied to money .

  4. By Ottis Anderson Fan on Dec 9, 2012 | Reply

    Another BiG nail in the Whiz/Grimm/Graves coffin. Another 3 nails (games) and we can bury them all.

    I wonder where all the people who think Skelton gives this team the best chance to win are now.

  5. By Ottis Anderson Fan on Dec 9, 2012 | Reply


    I think this is your shortest, “Aftermath” ever. Can’t blame you.

  6. By Ottis Anderson Fan on Dec 9, 2012 | Reply

    GO PACK GO!!!

  7. By Soares20 on Dec 9, 2012 | Reply

    The coaching staff needs to remain in tact. For the offensive line and the QB situation graves needs to be held accountable for what has happened on the offensive side of this team

  8. By Big Red Gen on Dec 9, 2012 | Reply

    Wow. Just sad. I feel bad for every one of those guys.

  9. By rufus on Dec 9, 2012 | Reply

    It’s time to clean house. I expect plenty of empty seats the last two home games. There’s no way I would pay to see this team play.

  10. By New season ticket holder on Dec 9, 2012 | Reply

    Only thing worse than hate is apathy. Apathetic towards this team. Definitely not renewing tickets

  11. By Chuck 1 on Dec 9, 2012 | Reply

    Mike L.,

    You are spot on about Graves’ atrocious performance. I’m sure that Dean Kennedy aka Patches would agree with us. Keim deserves quite a bit of blame also.

    Notice who the top two personnel are, as listed on the Cards’ website, under Football Operations:

    Rod Graves General Manager
    Steve Keim Vice President of Player Personnel

    Fans can blame Whiz for poor coaching decisions and I can agree that he has made several, but to blame him for draft and FA personnel decisions is wrong.
    If Whiz recommends that Graves draft or sign a FA player and Graves thinks that it’s a boneheaded idea, he MUST put on his GENERAL MANAGER HAT and say “NOT ONLY NO, BUT HELL NO”.

  12. By Patrick Eagan on Dec 9, 2012 | Reply

    Mike L… no more excuses. Its a QB driven game. The cardinals need one. They need an average one.. they don’t even have that. I did even watch the game. i didn’t know it was gonna be this bad though. Shocked, and disappointed.

  13. By Chuck 1 on Dec 9, 2012 | Reply

    On another topic, I think that fining and disciplining Dockett has pushed the team over the edge morale wise.
    I believe that the decision to punish him began with Horton, who recommended it to Whiz, who discussed it with Graves, who probably asked Michael for approval.
    All that was needed was for Horton and Whiz to have a private meeting with Dockett and STRONGLY tell him that he MUST do what the coaches tell him.
    Then, they could fine him $25,000.
    A team fine of $200,000 is outlandish.

  14. By Dean Kennedy on Dec 9, 2012 | Reply

    Mike L. – Agree 100%, Graves cannot escape this. If Mike Bidwill was really serious about changing the culture of the franchise Graves would have been fired long ago. Ergo, Mike Bidwill hasn’t been serious about changing the culture.

    Oh well, the team belongs to Pops and Mike runs it as he sees fit. I won’t buy it anymore unless Whis and Graves are gone, and the new GM and HC make the necessary moves in the offseason. 18 years is enough.

  15. By Chuck 1 on Dec 9, 2012 | Reply

    Now, on to Horton’s defense.
    As several fans have commented lately, he is not the Messiah of Defense that some think that he is.
    Otherwise, how could HIS defense allow 58 points TO ANYONE?

    And, is he ready to be a Head Coach for any team? NO!!!

  16. By canadian redbird on Dec 9, 2012 | Reply

    Darren, there is no question that Graves, Whiz, Grimm X 2, Miller, Quarterback and Receiver coach should be shown the door not now, but at the end of the season; even though 90% of Cardinal faithful want it done now. Hiring Horton is not the answer and to be perfectly honest, I don’t think the 3 – 4 matches our personnel and is the reason for our weak run defence.

    The coaching staff has lost the team as evidenced by the players reactions on the sidelines when the score was 50 + to 0. They may say the right things to the media but their actions reflect the lack of confidence they have in our leaders. I can’t remember feeling this frustrated with the team I follow so close. We need change at the end of the season. Sadly it could be a 2-3 year rebuild before we can compete with everyone else in the NFC West. Remember, St, Louis gets a boat load of draft picks this year, which doesn’t bode well for the Cards moving up the ladder.

    I feel sorry for Fitz, and agree with the commentator today that the present situation is a waste of a pro bowl & possible Hall of Fame receiver.

  17. By icsomu on Dec 9, 2012 | Reply

    I was in the stadium and was brutal to watch the game… That was like a complete breakdown…..

  18. By kauaicardsfan on Dec 9, 2012 | Reply

    Its not fair when our 3rd string offense is playing everyone’s 1st string defense!!

    I mean 2nd and 3rd string QB’s, rookie center and tackles. All left to play for is your job!

    Pride was all gone after this last game.

  19. By icsomu on Dec 9, 2012 | Reply

    Sorry to say this. If I were not a fan I would completely ask for a refund.

  20. By georgiebird on Dec 9, 2012 | Reply

    Cards’ are going nowhere this year- but this game has a big positive to it. To anyone thinking we can go into next year not having to worry about the defense- better think again. Seattle decided to push the ball against us all day and exposed our defense as very ordinary. The pass defense is bad and the rush defense is bad. The defense has escaped scrutiny because our offense has been so bad. There were many occasions where Seattle could have played more conservatively but they decided to press the issue. The Cards will be better for this when preparing for next year’s team.
    But most importantly, today showed that Ray Horton is not a talent in this league. His obsession with the 3-4 defense has painted him as coach who knows one scheme and is going to fit the players to the scheme whether the personnel fits or not. Even a layman knows if you don’t have a big time NT and big, fast linebackers, the 3-4 will get exposed.
    So if this game got the Cardinals’ off the Ray Horton bandwagon, it was a positive.

  21. By rdixon50 on Dec 9, 2012 | Reply

    Whiz and Graves need to resign/be fired Monday. After season, fire Miller and Grimm – have to keep some coaches for next three games. Bring in a QB NOW – Young, McNabb, etc. Simplify offense to 10 plays and let them go with it.

    Horton has obviously done a good job, but Whiz’s treatment of Dockett and Wilson has killed the D too.

    The Atlanta game broke my Cards spirit. Nothing but rust and bad taste left.

  22. By dan on Dec 9, 2012 | Reply

    I know why this team sucks, its obvious to probably any average football fan when you watch the Cardinals in the NFL draft every year. Game is won and lost at the line of scrimmage and QB, specifically the offensive line. It amazes me when teams take the “best available player” on the board. How about the best available player on the board for a position in need? Why draft friggin WR in the 1st round? Explain that one to me! I couldn’t believe it when they drafted Floyd, just idiotic. I swear, I can draft better than these people. I’m just a football fan who has watched football since I was a kid but I know talent when I see it. Sure we have drafted some good players but we’ve whiffed on a bunch and drafted the wrong positions in the wrong order.

  23. By Cactus Jeff on Dec 9, 2012 | Reply

    Point 1. Kurt Warner has constantly given clues during interviews that they went the super bowl DESPITE Whisenhunt, you have to know that.
    Point 2. Darnell Dockett is playing out of position, I know you know this. When he plays over the G he dominates, over the tackle he just isn’t long enough.
    Point 3. you have to know Fitz is not right, he has been concussed that past couple games. He is not right! They need to get him out for the rest of the year.

  24. By Lee on Dec 9, 2012 | Reply

    The coolaid tastes a little bitter right about now! Keep the coach, fire the GM, and get some better offensive line players in here!

  25. By cardsalltheway on Dec 9, 2012 | Reply

    Ottis Anderson Fan,

    “I wonder where all the people who think Skelton gives this team the best chance to win are now.”

    No QB can succeed under Ken W. unless we have a OC like Todd Haley. Horton has now caught the Ken W. plague, gotta clean house!

  26. By Brent on Dec 9, 2012 | Reply

    Whisenhunt has lost the team.

  27. By louie on Dec 9, 2012 | Reply

    Whiz has become a cancer, it started on offense and now the way he is treating vet defensive players is sad. They are done playing for him and i dont blame them. Whiz needs to be gone asap and i dont think it should go past tuesday. Really its been going downhill ever since they brought derrik anderson in. Was lienert really that bad? I dont think so. I would take him over all of these guys since Warner. Max Komar said, when whiz likes you he treats you good, but once you fall out of favor he treats you like cancer, didnt pay much too that then but the last 6 weeks is proof of it

  28. By Dan on Dec 9, 2012 | Reply

    Darren…I appreciate you for the reporting you have to do, especially when the Cards are as bad as they are this year. You have been objective, and have stayed the neutral course as long as you can. To be honest, there really is nothing that anyone can really say at this point, positive or negative, that will really help this team. Nor should we expect any miraculous words out of Whisenhunt’s mouth. It is a bad year that will not get any better, there are no “real” QB prospects in the draft that will turn around a franchise, and our defense is tired. It feels like they have been on the field 80% of the season, and that wears on you, so there should be no finger pointing there. Ultimately, (from my amateur point of view), we need to trade for a proven starting QB, no matter what the cost. Trade for a Philip Rivers? Alex Smith? Matt Cassel? Anyone who is proven to throw a ball? Once again, there are no saviors in the draft (especially Matt Barkley…can you name the last successful QB out of USC?). We need a new Offensive Coordinator, and I think we will be in good condition.
    Thanks for your patronage Darren!

  29. By cardsalltheway on Dec 9, 2012 | Reply

    Without Ken W. next week we win, with Ken W. we lose, it’s that simple.

    I don’t care who the Interim HC is, either Miller or Horton must be given the reins to see if the plague is gone. If we don’t fire Ken W. now/this week we’ll never know whether the plague can be rid of or not without cleaning house.

  30. By NJAzCardsFan on Dec 9, 2012 | Reply

    I have been a Cards fan since I was a little kid in the mid-60’s.
    This the worst loss ever in Cards history. I am glad didn’t waste my time watching this game, as the season was over when they lost to the Falcons.

    Graves has to go as well as Keim. Who drafts a QB with a 60% completion history???
    Historically, the Cards always have suffered at the QB positon with the exception of 4 QB’s in their history. Hell, Max Hall showed more promise than Lindley has this year. Even Vince Young couldn’t be this bad….. could he???

    The loss today showed that Whiz has loss control of the team and their respect. They weren’t focusing on playing today, just going through the motions. I am close to putting an end to being a Cards fan. No one should have to suffer through this debactle every year. I actually think there are college teams out there that could beat the Cards right now….. They should be #33 in the power rankings……
    Yes, they are that bad.

    Watching this team is like trying to push a giant frozen turd up hill and only have it roll back down the hill and melt on top of you……

    Darren- It is true the Cards are holding open QB tryouts in the parking lot tomorrow???

  31. By Havasu Tom on Dec 9, 2012 | Reply

    Hi Darren,
    That was a bitter pill to swallow. What we lack is Todd Haley. Todd would fight for what he believed was right and was also good with the QB’s. Since Todd left for Kansas City, we’ve struggled with every QB. I believe they’ve been mis managed and lack a solid QB coach.

  32. By Fan4Life on Dec 9, 2012 | Reply

    The team has lost heart. Dockett created BIRDGANG on twitter and gave it away tonight. The outrageous fine by management pushed the team over the edge. Morale was already down, they just pushed the whole team over the cliff. When a soldier is down who is a leader, you don’t keep kicking him, you help him up and encourage him and the rest of the team follow. Management/coaches did this to themselves and the team. We never had an offensive line to being with, now we’ve lost our D-line due to loss of morale. Thanks STAFF! Great job!

  33. By cardsalltheway on Dec 9, 2012 | Reply

    My Seahawks Defense got 41 points in Fantasy Football:)

    Win 58 – 0, 3 Sck, 4 Int, 4 Fum, 2 TD

  34. By Jzoully on Dec 9, 2012 | Reply

    I stick with Whisenhunt, he is a great coach and it is not completely his fault, I will say that his evaluation of quarterbacks is lackadaisical. I will say that he is a great coach and teacher, but I will say that if he wants to succeed Rod Graves needs to resign. I know, that’s betrayal from a fan, but we are seriously needing a quarterback this next season. No lie the season is dead, and I said this when we went down 58-0, “What I would do to get the season to end today.” But it won’t. Look forward to the draft, I know I am. Couple prospects I hope to see. 1. Logan Thomas – Virginia Tech 2. Tajh Boyd – Clemson 3. Mike Glennon – North Carolina State.

  35. By Jzoully on Dec 9, 2012 | Reply

    Ok I wanna go ahead and say that it saddens me that fans have forgotten that Whisenhunt TOOK US TO THE SUPERBOWL!!! Cardsalltheway, Chuck 1 get out of here because no matter what happens you shouldn’t bail ship on the coach who took us so far, our offense and special turns the ball over 8 times how do you suppose our defense to play better. Just jump ship already you guys are saddening to read. This is still the Arizona Cardinals and they will one day win the Superbowl. Take that to the bank.

  36. By Madriffs on Dec 9, 2012 | Reply

    Very sad to see the team played so poorly, even more sad to see there is absolutely no loyalty from the fans. I will continue to support the Cards and hope things turn around for them. GO CARDS!

  37. By Red Dead Not Redemption on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    I suffered through some dreadful years, especially in High School in the 80’s. The Cowboys fans were the worst, but all fans in general asked me why I even bothered wearing my hat and jacket to school sometimes.
    I always said, if you are a fan, you are a fan, regardless if it’s just a bad year.
    However this game today was, horrible, beyond horrible, it really made me reflect why I even bother anymore.
    This wasn’t losing, this wasn’t getting owned, This wasn’t about being as over matched as the score; this was not caring at all about the fans.
    I don’t want to hear about how “It was just a bad game”, they insulted the fans and don’t think over half the players even care.
    In fact it seems they hold it against the fans, that they aren’t happy with this team.
    They say how they need to stick together, even if the fans and media are against them.
    It seems after a point, most of these guys were happy with the paychecks and today was the day this team on average doesn’t care.
    It was a good run to the Superbowl, especially after 25+ years of insults but most of the players and the team I liked has moved on.
    So even though, the logo is in place, this isn’t the favorite team I knew in the past.
    I honestly think we could have and should have at least made and won a few Superbowls with the talent this team had.
    From when Warner was signed, Boldin and Fitz in the early years was amazing, among others, it’s sad it was wasted by two bad coaches, and a horrible GM.
    If this team doesn’t care neither did I, I won’t be back as a fan, until they clean house and start new.

  38. By Rick on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    If nobody gets fired over this I will be shocked. Fire someone to let us fans know that this organization is committed to win NOW. Offensive coordinator needs to go. Pretty much all the offensive coaches need to go in order to keep season ticket holders around for next year. What an embarrassment !

  39. By JohnfromOz on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    Inept, embarrassing, gutless and a total joke.
    Coach who can’t, players won’t and what would appear to be a toxic team and club culture.

  40. By suspence716 on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    How can any of you people have watched whisenhunt destroy this team since the superbowl and still want to keep him around? The guy is in way over his head and finally the players aren’t playing for him anymore. No more whiz with his BS best chance to win and his horrible drafts…. Should have drafted Adrian peterson but wanted levi brown and the list goes on….. Get this wanna be outta town already!!!

  41. By DirtybirD on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    Time for Michael Bidwill to put on the Big Boy pants and clean house. Yes Michael that means Rod Graves, Whiz, Mike Miller, Russ Grimm and his son! The failure to evaluate overall talent and have quality drafts and sign quality free agents has put this team in a hole. Thanks Rod. COME ON, who’s the best offensive player drafted during “Whiz’s era”, 2009 rd 7 LaRod Stephens- Howling? To say Whiz, the offensive staff and current QBs give the Cardinals the best chance to win going forward is like having a race car team with Danica Patrick as your driver. Sure you get excited in the beginning, is easy on the eyes but then the race car starts to get lapped in every race and then finally crashes into the wall…..

  42. By 4 n 12 Cards on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    I heard the guys on the radio after the game saying what happened to the defense today was an inevitable breakdown that was bound to happen sooner or later because of a number of reasons including them being tired, unmotivated and a feeling of frustration because of game after game of ZERO offensive performance. I agree with that 110%. Today had nothing to do with Horton at all. This is a game of momentum and the defense could only perform the way they were for so long with nothing at all on offense. It’s amazing they haven’t had this happen until today.

    It’s time to completely get rid of every coach offensively, all the QB’s, the RB’s and go all out with the dollars with all new OC right to all the assistants, new QB’s, RB’s, OL. And if you ever get a once in a lifetime opportunity such as when Manning was here THROW EVERYTHING AND THE KITCHEN SINK at them to get them here, not take the stupid attitude we will “develop” what we have. That worked out so well.

    The fans need to hammer this home by NOT going to any more games until they do. Hurt the pocketbook of the ownership of this team and maybe that will wake them up.

  43. By stevenanimator on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    Reading what the local sports writers are saying – it sounds like the organization (namely the Bidwill’s) will not easily give up the amount of money that’s guaranteed for Whisenhunt. The same situation effected their decision to stick with Kolb. So then any of us frustrated fans look as to why the organization made such deals with players and coaches knowing that they would end up being stuck with personnel that either have failed to earn their contracts or have become ineffective. GM Rod Graves has to go along with Whisenhunt. Coach Wiz did a lot of great things for this organization and team, but his shortcomings with QB’s shows that it’s time for the team to go in a different direction. If the Bidwill’s continue to ignore that reality, they will squander a loyal fan base that increasingly feels frustrated with some of the poor decision making.

  44. By cardsalltheway on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    Havasu Tom,
    I partly agree with you but we must realize that Todd Haley was the OC during Ken W.’s first year as HC which means that even an excellent OC would probably fail these days under Ken W. because his head has swollen/he thinks much more of himself now for whatever reason. Therefore he demands more power from his subordinates. Ken W.’s underlings probably don’t feel very comfortable doing what they need to do to make the team better because of HIS system.

  45. By Jesus on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply


    Either way always a fan.

    But ownership needs to make a move ASAP

    How do you expect us as fans to support this team, ownership is not committed to putting a winning product out on the field.

    Someone needs to be fired!

    I will not watch another game this season unless someone loses their job.

  46. By vegas4u2012. on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    The bottom line is-the fans pay EVERYONES salary in this organization.Without us,nobody pays there bills!So therefore,to “THE BIDWELLS”,you need to listen.With that being said,from what i’m hearing,the majority wan’t a shakeup in the front office.GRAVES,I’TS YOUR TURN TO GO!!Give someone else a chance.You had yours!As for the Q’BS.Skelton & Lindley will never be any better than 3rd.stringers in the NFL.I’m not a fan of extreme change w/3 games left.So next year,get a solid veteran QB. to compete w/Kolb&do what it takes to improve the O-LINE through the draft etc.The 49ers.drafted two top offensive lineman a few years back(Remember the old saying,”You win the war in the trenches”)& look how that brought stability to their offense w/a mediocre QB.I Fully understand all the fans frustration,but at the same time,as a buisness,you can’t just go out there and let go of everyone!

  47. By Don W on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    I want Graves gone by the end of the week. Then the next 3 weeks will determine the fate of the rest of the coaching staff.

  48. By Louisville Card on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    Hi Darren,

    Rough loss and unfortunately for several people sealed their fate. No way Skelton or Lindley ever see the feild in a regular season NFL game again after this season.

    I’ve been one of the biggest Whiz supporters, but there is no way he’s back after this game. He has obviously lost the team. The $200,000 fine lost the players, and there isn’t any way he’s getting them back. The one bright spot out of this week is it looks like the cards are going to lock up the third pick. Bring on Te’o!!!

    Darren my question to you, which I’m sure you would prefer to wait on, is what names do you think we might see come in for the coaching spot? Reid has lost his luster. Turner is just an OC. Cowher and Gruden don’t seem like the answer or willing to leave their cush TV jobs. Horton obviously just cost himself any chance of getting the job with this last game and being a part of Dockett decision. Who’s left? Would they consider Marty Schottenheimer? He’s been a great regular season coach just really unlucky in the playoffs which isn’t his fault. Or do they go coordinator or college head coach?

  49. By Darren Urban on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    Louisville —

    RE: coach

    I have no idea. And I’m also one of those that doesn’t believe in speculating on the next coach until the current one is no longer there.

  50. By Louisville Card on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    Thanks for the very classy response I was jumping the gun a little with my question.

  51. By jake huston on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    what a joke way to give up team. been fan for years watched every game

  52. By Scottish Cards Fan on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    Ooft now that was horrible. Even all these 1000’s of miles away in Scotland I can smell the stench coming from the Cardinals organisation. I think all we can do now is look ahead and start planning for the 2013 draft and season. Hopefully without the likes of Graves and Grimm involved in any part, as I believe they are the weak links within the organisation. I’d like to say I’d give Whiz another year to lead the way but I’m even struggling to muster any support for him, considering the decline of the team from where it was only a few years ago. Those good years feel like a lifetime ago.

    To be honest losing the final 3 games may be a good thing for the team, as then they can start rebuilding through a good place in the draft. All of us Cards fans are beginning to sound like broken records when we scream out for a franchise QB (a healthy one preferably) and a group of O-linemen who can protect this QB. Hopefully this year the organisation will actually take on board these comments and go some way to rectify the issue. Skelton, Lindley, Grimm and Grave, along with some of the o-line should all be looking for a new career in the offseason. Maybe Kurt Warner could help out by getting them all a job in the Supermarket he used to work in. The only reason I haven’t berated the defense for their performance yesterday is because there is only so long a unit within a team can be out under so much pressure by the rest of the team before it starts to crumble. Offense stand up and take the credit for ruining a perfectly good Cardinal D.

    Rant over

  53. By Rick Von on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    I know you said last week that you don’t think there will be an in season coaching change, but I have to believe that after this loss, there is no way Mikey B can let this go on any longer. The Wuzz, Mike Miller, Russ Grimm & Rod Graves all need to go. TODAY !!

  54. By jason marcus on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    Worst team in the NFL by far the entire offense should not be back next year except Fitz ……fire everyone we have NO offense what so ever ! Whiz is stubborn and should be fined 200gs for his crap coaching and staff …….we suck this together!

  55. By jason marcus on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply


  56. By Rich on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    Wish I had something clever to say.

  57. By cardsalltheway on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    cobra(December 7th, 2012),
    ” We have one of the best Ds in the league.”

    Oh cobra, gosh golly gee we lost 58 – 0 and I suppose you still think we have “one of the best D’s in the league” after giving up 58 points on December 9th aye? Hahahahaha!!!!! Oh and one more thing, go back to that recent blog post(“Inside Kolbs Insides”) where you claimed that I contradict myself, do you even know what that word means?

  58. By Cardinal's Chick on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    How discouraging…they gave up. I agree that the defense was bound to implode at some point. The 2nd/3rd string O-Line can’t keep offense on the field long enough for defense to rest. I don’t agree that Whisenhunt should be fired. There are too many other variables…mostly on offense right now….primarily injury related. One can only hope that they can pull out a couple of wins to close out the season…something to renew their morale.

    No matter…I am, and will always be a Cardinal’s fan. Ride or die….

  59. By johnnybluenose on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    way back on sept 8th, before the season started and when most of us were pretty optimistic about our cardinals this year, someone named BUDDY THE TOWN WINNER posted on this blog that peterson will win 4 or 5 games this year. i don’t recall that BUDDY has posted since but i have to wonder, now that this terrible season will mercifully soon be over, has he ever asked himself how he could have gotten it so wrong. i know i have. i was predicting 10 or 11 wins and a strong play-off run. with a healthy kolb we probably finish 8 and 8 but that still would have been a disappointment. and i’ve said it before and i will say it again. we are not getting our money’s worth out of larry fitzgerald. he is getting close to one million dollars a game and yesterday he caught one pass for a gain of two yards. i am pretty sure he had another one reception game this year for something like four yards. sure, we have had quarterback issues and coaching issues and a poor running game which means the defense can usually afford to pay special attention to fitz. but other elite receivers draw special attention and they are getting the job done, often making difficult catches. fitz still has great hands but maybe, just maybe he has trouble getting separation from the defenders. and maybe, as some have suggested, he is injured. whatever the case, we would have been better off investing that money in an offensive line than in an elite receiver who is ineffective.

  60. By Kevin on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    This is a mess from top to bottom right now. According to Mike Jurecki of XTRA Sports 910, when Whisenhunt negotiated his extension, he negotiated having the final say over the 53 man roster. So either he is not listening to talent evaluators like Steve Keim or he simply is a poor talent evaluator. Either way, if the players on this roster are ultimately up to Whisenhunt, then he takes the blame for the product on the field. His inability to secure a QB is beyond ridiculous. Russ Grimm has yet to produce an offensive line that plays consistently. Grimm, one would think, has input into players and scheme and it’s not working. I don’t know how many people could underperform at their job and still keep it after this long. Additionally, the offensive play calling is atrocious, although with what there is to work with, it doesn’t really matter what play is called and who calls it. As for Michael Bidwill, who I think has done very well with this team, and Rod Graves, ultimately it is Bidwill who entrusted Graves to run the operation. If Graves conceded that much power to the coaching staff, then he needs to go too. You can’t let the inmates run the asylum and in this case, Whisenhunt may be too close to the forest to see the trees. I like Whisenhunt and I think he’s a good coach. I think though that one a couple of his best qualities, being stubborn and ultra competitive ultimately may also be his worst.

  61. By Cert 33 on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    First of all, I watched the game and did not see the Cardinal defense give up 58 points. I must have missed that part. I no longer think that the necessary changes need to wait until the off-season as things have already bottomed out and the defense needs to be kept intact. If he is willing (and that’s a big if), I would name Ray Horton interim head coach tomorrow morning and terminate Graves, Whisenhunt, Miller, Grimm, and the QB coach. John Skelton should also be cut tomorrow and Rich Bartel brought in as the back-up. The fine against Darnell Dockett would also be dismissed immediately. Let the last three games be basically a “try-out” for the assistants and players that wish to remain Cardinals.

  62. By smack28 on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    Anyone that thinks firing Whiz and hiring Horton as new HC is out of their mind. Those moves would be more of the same, in my opinion. Think about it, Horton has no experience as a HC. If Whiz goes and Horton takes over, this team will be in the same position they find themselves in every year – the “Let’s see what we have” mode. Of course the team will rally around Horton and win two or three games. Then, a decision will have to come. Many will push for hiring Horton based on how they finished the season. If he gets the job because of winning two or three games, it will be like annointing Skelton at QB for his performance at the end last year. This team needs leadership on all fronts – QB, coaching, management, ownership, etc. Good thing I can jump on the Texans’ bandwagon. This will take years to fix.

  63. By a somewhere cards fan on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    Fans pay to watch a football game and not to watch a bunch of guys TRYING to play a football game. These fans-who-pay-to-watch-a-football-game will decrease as strong as buildings during an earthquake… What has this team shown in offense the last THREE years? nothing… even Browns have played a better football.

    I agree with everyone up here that a clean has to me made immediately, GM, OC, HC and etc have to go, Cards are not only wasting money, but time, they are uncapable of signing good players, it seems they get the other teams’ leftovers and put them into the field, like old cards out of a junkyard!

    I’m sure if a clean isn’t made I will no more watch a single cardinals game. I’m just tired.

  64. By chris B on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    You’ll forgive me if I don’t take your opinions seriously. After all, most of you were screaming for Skelton to start this season despite the fact he played just as bad last year as he is this year. Now that “your guy” is showing his colors, you want Whiz to be fired? Ok….

    I think it would be a mistake to fire Whiz this year. He needs a franchise QB. No coach should be fired without one. Meaning; every coach is given a chance to win with “their guy”. Whiz hasn’t had “his guy”. Well, he did for 2 years in Warner and we know how that went. Funny how people give Warner credit for the wins in 08-09 but forget it was Whiz who gave him a 2nd chance. If you look back at the HCs who have been fired, all of them have 1 thing in common; they couldn’t win with “their guy”. If they took a team over with a franchise QB and couldn’t win, they were fired. If they missed on a 1st round QB it set the franchise back 5 years. Baltimore (04ish), Cleveland, Miami, Jets, Buffalo, etc, etc all have missed on 1st rounders in the past 10 years and all were set back at least 5 years. Leinart was drafted in 06 and Whiz hired in 07. Why should Whiz be held responsible for Graves and Green whiffing on Leinart? (2006 + 5 year set back = 2011 draft)

    And people say Horton should be the next HC because he is better? Um… his defense just allow 44 points. Why should he not be blamed for that?

    I doubt Whiz will make it past this game. But when people say it’s because he had x losing streaks, who cares? It is better to go 8-8 by winning 1 and then losing 1? He also had winning streaks in those years too, but I guess they don’t count? This type of reasoning is asinine.

    We need a QB. We need Kolb to get better. I say give him 1 more year to find his QB. If there is no improvement, then find someone else.

  65. By Blair on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    Pretty sure he has had three years to pick “his guy”. So he deserves a fourth year? I don’t think so

  66. By Rio on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    Big fine on Dockett by Biewells did it , lost defense. they all love Dockett, feelings were Bidwells needed extra $200,000 for Christmas.

    They should have just left it alone, the guy just didn’t want to give up touchdown on defense, what is wrong with that thinking.

    Big mistake for Bidwells.

  67. By MIKE G on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    Hey Darren–Hope u r good! That was as bad a loss as I have seen watching Cardinals football. This was an epic loss in Cardinal history. I dont know if there is anything worse in sports then a 9 game losing streak in the NFL. It is going to take much effort to dig out of this and try to salvage a win by the end of the season.
    Your manhood is definitely tested with this losing streak. The injuries, poor performance(especially Qb), lack of confidence, inconsistent coaching and team disruption(Dockett) is crippling the mental state of this team right now. Unfortuately I dont think the team has the horses right now to come up with a win. Leaders must step up–but I just dont see it happening. I think the Card’s defense is really frustrated– I mean they get 6 turnovers at Atlanta and 3 at the Jets and have nothing to show for it–Darren–Do you think there is a seperation between the players on offense and defense on this football team–I dont think the defense thinks it can win with the current state of the Cards offense right now—Hence the 58 points???.

  68. By Darren Urban on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    Mike G —

    RE: Defense

    I get frustration, but there is no excuse for any part of the team to play like it did yesterday.

  69. By Tucson Card on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    Still a die-hard.

    As a U of A and Cards fan, I’ve seen some pretty rough football seasons.

    Looking forward to the draft and the offseason, should be pretty fun to watch.

    Til the bitter end.

    Otis Fan: Later dude, have fun being a bandwagon Wisconsin fan.

  70. By Chuck 1 on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    It’s time for fans to organize an “AINTS” style protest (bags over the heads) for the remaining home games. JUST DO IT!!!

    It’s also time for fans to cancel their season ticket purchases for 2013 and not purchase single game tickets.

    If you don’t hit the Bidwills in the wallet, you’ll get more results like this season.

  71. By jocards on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    Wow, it is time for some house cleaning. I don’t just mean the coaching staff either though Whisenhunt’s time is certainly just about up. This team is pathetic. Guys that are supposed to be team leaders just disregard instructions from the coach one week and the entire team just lays down the next week?!? Clearly that speaks volumes about the coach having lost his team but it also speaks volumes about the players in general and Darnell Dockett in particular. The team has little choice about what to do with the coach IMO, you can’t move forward with a head coach that doesn’t have the respect of his team. Coach Whisenhunt himself certainly owns some responsibility for that but Darnell Dockett who supposedly is one of the team leaders gets a big share too IMO.. To all the folks that are backing Darnell Dockett have you considered what happens when he decides that he won’t follow the instructions of the next head coach either? Blow this thing up and start again because we don’t have the leaders on the sideline or in the locker room that are needed. I think Whisenhunt needs to go but I am NOT onboard with any player no matter how good they are or how much money they make just deciding that he will not listen to the coach. Like I said I think Whisenhunt’s time is up but I am really looking forward to seeing what kind of a message the front office is going to send to the players in regard to this Dockett issue…to me a big fine is just not enough. Sorry when a team goes out and gets kicked 58-0 they have a lot bigger problems than merely the head coach and GM. It is certainly time to clean house but it shouldn’t end with the coaches and front office people, it should merely begin there.

  72. By wnycardfan on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    not much to add to these rants, other than I share all of them that say do a clean sweep, including front office. They all need to go asap.
    He lost the team with his BS and never taking his own accountability. While Dockett may have been wrong to disagree, his approach and fine were BS. Good job pissing off the only part of the team working half way decent.
    Jaws on mike and mike today in reply to a question on why so many teams have POOR QB performance was “COACHING” stinks. They mentioned several teams in this boat, AZ was one of them as we’ve been saying. Can we please just get half way decent football where we “THINK” we have a chance to make playoffs or at least we can SEE progress and know that as a year goes by we’ll be better.
    Someone said it, the 3 other teams in NFC West are on the rise, Cards are their stepping stone (whopping boy, B*tch, etc) and not only last, but dead and buried last. There is NO WAY we are a winning organization in the next 2 – 3 years. I don’t see any AWESOME QB’s available nor a coach (like a Harbaugh) waiting in the wings. Face it, they jammed us for the last 2 – 3 years into being a crappy team, it will take at least that long IF WE ARE LUCKY to be back to 50/50.
    Bidwill needs to get his head out of his rear point of contact and run this organization

  73. By Oh NO...we suck again. on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    I did not watch the game but did jay feely really fly all the way to Seattle to kick the ball off one time…bidwill’s missed that opportunity to save that money on airfair. we could really use it in the off season to hire a big school SECish QB. think about it we have had recently a Fordham, BYU, San Diego St., USC QB draft pick. fire the coaches and hire someone who can see talent in a top 10 college team at quarterback. we can never afford a manning.n FIRE WHIZ promote HORTON!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  74. By David on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    Moving here in early 2000 to attend ASU, I instantly adopted the Cardinals as my own. And as a season ticket holder for the past seven years, I’ve supported them through all highs and lows. But I’m done. I will not be renewing my tickets (Sec. 121). I can’t justify spending my hard earned dollars, especially in this economy, on a team this bad, both in organization and on field product.

    I also want to point out I’ve been beating the “Fire Whiz” drum since he prematurely released Matt Leinart, and had quite a few spirited conversions with Darren here over it. I saw through Whiz even then, his flaws and how Denny’s personnel and Kurt Warner were truly the reason for our rise.

    Until I see radical changes, I can’t justify spending money in the stadium. It’s that simple.

  75. By philly cards 1994- on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    For the past three seasons I been complaining about whiz. Only to see card fans keep the light on for him 2010 2011. And now its clearly obvious this might be the worst coach we ever had (ill expalain)

    In 2010 whiz got his 5m $ deal first. Then graves -who had no contract, got his.I want the anti graves people to understand. When bidwill saw haley warner and boldin leave he gave theys to whiz.

    Graves is cap guy and kiem is the scout the past 3 yrs. In the past if rod graves wanted a player he showed at the press conference. After he and whiz got new deals he was never at one that I saw,why? They are whiz guys.

    Whiz has slowly broken up the most talented team in card history. With personal conflicts.
    He failed with youth( breaston and drc) and he failed without help he had previous to 2010

    We had dansby and antrell leave via FA. Its not just warner

    Wasted roster spots of qbs with guys who never played. St pierre (another steeler) and bartell

    Wasted te spots with indecision

    And adam syder blows

    Now we add adub and dockett and others to the hate list.

    remeber boldin was the first guy. The heart of this team. He was traded. And bidwills don’t give #81 to just anyone but they still chose whiz. And they are paying for it.

    Still not convinced? Look at the failed ex-steeler that rod graves?or kiem? Nope. They’ve been here for over 10yrs and we’ve never seen this from them

    Its whiz.get the redcoats out of the cleaners and fire this man bidwills!!!

  76. By Dean Kennedy on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    Why does everybody assume Ray Horton would want the Cardinals HC job? As long as the status quo is in place with Rod The Empty Suit Graves playing errand boy for Mike “We Need a New Stadium to Compete” Bidwill, I would think someone as smart as Horton would steer clear. He can be a DC damn near anywhere he wants and if he keeps building his reputation he could do a lot better than the Cardinal Carnival.

  77. By Dynosoar on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    Todd Haley people,

    Have you watched Kansas City the last few years, have you watched Pittsburgh this year. Just as some claim Whizenhunt was better because of Kurt Warner, so was Todd Haley.

    Warner changed the plays at the line of scrimage all the time. The elite quarterbacks always do. Great leaders make all those around them great. We don’t need a quarterback, we need a leader. A leader that throws >60% accuracy.

    I’m a Cardinals fan. Wearing my Cardinals red today. I’ll always be a Cardinals fan. Yesterday just plain sucked, but as bad as it is for me to endure, I wasn’t on the field for those 60 minutes of play.

    To the players of my team; we were outplayed and it happens. Life is not about winning all the time, it’s about the journey. I’m behind you 100% and win or lose, you’re my team and I’m rooting for you. I want you to win the next three weeks to have some joy in Mudville, but win or lose I’m grateful I can see Cardinals red (or white and red trim) each week (except the bye) of the season. Thanks for being my team.

  78. By Dean Kennedy on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    To: Chuck 1: I’m on board, firing Graves and Whis is my MINIMUM requirement to consider renewing next year after 18 years. I would need to see how the new GM/Bidwill and coach handle the draft, free agency, coaching staff, etc.

  79. By Kevin S on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    I don’t know what to think. 58-0 is embarrassing, but honestly, I don’t worry (as some fans seem to) about being “embarrassed.” These guys are professional athletes, they’ll be fine. And as much as I love to be a fan of my sports teams, I don’t care if some idiots at work make fun of me for wearing my Cardinals hat. It’s not like I actually play for the team. We were out of this game early in the 2nd quarter, so at that point, while I watched the rest, did not really care if it ended up 58-0 or 49-14. What difference does it make?

    I agree 100% that the D is not as good as some people want to believe, but it is the strength of the team as compared to the offense. And come on, the D did not give up 58 points (Chuck 1 says how could Horton’s D give up 58 points to anyone?) On our opening drive they returned an INT to our 14 yard line. D held SEA without a first down and they only got a FG. So that’s 3 on the offense. SEA’s next drive, Lynch ran all over us. 7 on the D. Next drive, 67 yard pass play. 7 more on the D. Then, on our next drive, Skelton fumbles and SEA recovers in our territory, but we get a 3-and-out and force a punt. 2 plays later, Skelton pick-6. 7 more on the offense. We get the ball back, 3 and out and punt. D holds SEA to another 3 and out and a punt, and PP fumbles this one and SEA gets a TD out of it. 7 more not on the D.

    At that point it’s 31-0 and the D has let up 14 of the 31 points. Then, after the TD on the PP fumble, we get the ball back, run a few more plays, and have to punt again. In a lone bright spot, PP then gets an INT on the very next play, and we actually have the ball in SEA territory, only to watch another INT by Skelton give it right back almost immediately. Defense then holds yet again, forcing another punt by SEA, and PP fumbles AGAIN, given SEA the ball on our 24. D lets up 24-yard TD w/ 6 seconds, but SEA was going to likely get a FG out of that situation anyway, so at most you can hold the D responsible for 4 of those 7 points. And who can blame the D for mailing it in somewhat and allowing the TD to end the half when they’ve allowed only 14 points up to that point, and yet we are totally out of the game because (a) there are another 17 points they haven’t let up, (b) we have 0 points because our O is so terrible, and (c) yet another turnover just forced them back on the field with SEA deep in our territory. The second half didn’t even matter so who really cares, although it’s worth pointing out that two more turnovers by our O gave SEA the ball in our territory leading to FG’s that weren’t our D’s fault either.

    Point simply being, no one on the Cards played well, and our run defense in particular left something to be desired, but it’s not fair to point to a 58-0 score and act like our O and D are equally bad. At the beginning of the game they had to be thinking a little bit of “here we go again” after they’re out there following an opening-drive turnover by our O, trying to stop SEA from scoring when they are spotted the ball on our 14. And they held. I’m not going to say “give them some credit” because no one deserves credit for this game, but the D doesn’t deserve nearly the blame that the other side of the ball does.

  80. By jfelty on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    I am tired of seeing these comments. The QB coach has done an excellent job with Kolb but has not done anything with the other two QBs. Remember when Kolb first got here and he would always run the moment a blitz would happen now he hangs in there to make the pass play or try and extend it when needed. As for Kiem and Graves and Grimm all three need to go. Grimm can’t teach and the other two suck when it comes to evaluating player ability. The way the Oline plays is the QB has 2 seconds and then needs to throw and trust the WR would be were he needs to be. That was what made Warner so good. His time in the Arena Football league helped him do that. The Docket situation made it to were our D gave up as alot of folks have said. Our OC bites he does not play to our strengths which we need. This team cannot do the I formation and expect to get yardage on a run. Our offense is to predictable and that is what is allowing us to not succeed. Defense doing a great job granted this game was a wipeout but every team is allowed a couple of those a year. This would not have happened though if they did not do what they did to Dockett. I agree with Docket we should not allow another team to score just so we could have the ball back.

  81. By GW on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    To all of you new cards fans need to understand as long as pop bidwill and family owns this team you will always be broken hearted. you guys really need to research the cards history in the nfl,with their fans (st.louis), their (star)players,and pop bidwill tight wallet.because he owns the team not mike bidwill let me give you some examples of some of the things the cards do they sign big name players at the end of their carreers for a year or two so the fans think that they trying to build a good team examples emmitt smith,edgerrin james,warner (got lucky with that one),haggans & the other pitt lb i forget his name,seth joyner just to name a few then look at all the players from the organization that earn they pay and the cards let go my favorite terry metcalf,ottis anderson,conrad dobler,eric swann,(wr.)boston,jake plummer,boldin,rolle,dansby,aeneus williams,and you can add fitz. to this list soon and remember they did not want to pay warner until he threaten to talk to the 49’ers.they don’t care about the fans only the bottom $$$. BOYCOTT THIS TEAM UNTIL THEY CHANGE THIER WAYS.Im going to watch a real team tonight GO PATS.

  82. By jocards on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    @ GW –

    You are absolutely correct about the history of this organization and the Bidwill family…..The sustained level of futility is absolutely staggering by any measure.

  83. By Kevin S on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    And I do feel bad for Skelton. As I’ve said on this blog, I did not want him to be the Cards QB this year, as I don’t think he is starting QB material (at least at this point in his career). But to get thrown in there against SEA on the road after not playing (other than the first quarter of ATL) in 3 weeks, and with the overall struggles our O has had, must’ve been tough. Still, though, people talked after the STL game about “how can you leave a guy in there with 4 INT’s,” etc., but at least in that game, Lindley had put up a decent first half, with 17 points. Skelton managed 4 INT’s in just 22 attempts, spanning one half plus one pass. (And yes, I know the first INT is not really on him, but the other 3 looked like they were 100% on him, unless we’re going to hear something about receivers running the wrong routes or something.)

    As much as we fans are going to talk about it just as we always have, it unfortunately probably doesn’t matter much any more this season who the Cards trot out there as the QB.

  84. By WiskyTango on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    WOW……from a 4-0 start to losing everything else? Can’t wrap my mind around it. I have been a Cards fan my whole life, still am. Where is the leadership?? Whiz took it all in stride, he just stayed calm and talked on his microphone thorugh the whole ordeal. Not once did I see him running up and down the side line or trying to motiviate his players. Heck, he didn’t even yell at any of them for screwing up. Whiz is not a coach we need to keep around any longer. Don’t get me wrong, I am not saying it is all his fault the past couple of years, but allowing the team to steadily decline, ummm, yes I guess a lot of it is. The team needs a couple of leaders, first a coach and secondly a quarterback whose stats when recruited doesn’t make him a third stringer from day one. Too many key players have been traded away and now there is no more team. Not sure who is making these decisions, the coach, the GM, the owner, but the team is being destroyed internally. Yes, I am a loyal fan with season tickets; however, if Whiz is here in 2013, I WILL NOT buy season tickets next year. I will just have to be satisfied going to UofA and ASU games….which were a lot better this year by the way.

  85. By jason marcus on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    Thank you, Darren Urban for letting us fans vent this out, you mean a lot to all of us ,you always do a great job for us……Thank You. JM

  86. By Chris on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    Who is our practice squad QB? Why not give him a shot, or run the PAT-CAT. In the off season maybe we can get a QB in the 3rd round, replacing a 5th round pick with a 6th round pick will not get it done in the NFL, neither of these QB’s would be in the NFL it wasn’t for the Cards. Who’s fault is it that we dont have a viable option at QB?

  87. By hminus on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    great game plan,alienate the only unit that has excelled for this team the whole season- in spite of having no support & nothing to play for/of course dockett & most of the d-players find the idea of intentionally allowing td’s to the opposition to be repulsive under ANY circumstance at all, this type of an attitude is the only reason i was still paying attention,( the reason why it made some sense for new england to try the tactic in the superbowl is because their offense can actually score points-which gives the defense the confidence to go along w/ a plan like that,) but our situation is far different & when your offense is as anemic & unimaginative as ours is,its no wonder defensive leaders rebelled, don’t forget “attitude reflects leadership” , & our team needs a change in that area quite soon.

  88. By Cert 33 on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    Once again, it appears some of us are watching different teams during 2012. Since the Dolphins exposed our O-Line to the world and shot down what appeared to be a promising season, followed not long after by the loss of our only decent QB, the offense has consistently been rated anywhere from 30th- 32nd in the various offensive categories. All pundits seem to agree that the Cardinal O-Line is the absolute worst in Pro Football. The Defense, on the other hand, has been consistently rated around 7th overall in the NFL. Horton had been shooting for a “top 5” rating by the end of the season but yesterday’s fiasco probably did that in. The point is, if we keep the defense and it’s staff intact for 2013, we probably could start with an absolute clean slate on Offense next year and still be a possible contender in the NFC west. If we are forced to rebuild on both sides of the ball,we will be in last place for several years before we see positive results. Let’s let Horton be interim coach for the last 3 games and see what has. I believe the teams are allowed a roster expansion soon as well to look at some free agents.

  89. By BIG RED on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    Why all this complaining for the team. The only good thing about this is December 21st is the end of the world. It can’t get any worst.

  90. By Doug Woiwod on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    Its okay guys, our basketball team isn’t worth a damn, either. U R
    not alone at the bottom…

  91. By johnnybluenose on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    the baltimore ravens, a play-off contending team, just fired their offense co-ordinator. we have lost nine consecutive games and have not scored a toucdown in the last two games. in fact, we have struggled to get first downs. we have not heard one word from management or ownership about any of our coaches. everyone has quit on this season…..ownership,management, coaches, players and FANS. there has been a disturbing lack of urgency within this team to right this ship and we have all seen the result. and those of you who have been saying that our defense is no better than average….you are absolutely right. this team needs a major overhaul and it won’t get better any time soon.

  92. By Phxhiker on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    Bartel should be brought back.

  93. By jfelty on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    hminus you are right and that was the point I was trying to make myself. No coach should ever tell a defense to let them score and then punish someone for not letting them thats telling the folks if you do your job your goign to get fined and then benched.

  94. By Campbells on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    Historically, we’re always late to the party. A year ago, we should’ve selected a QB in the first round. Totally mismanaged that situation, by picking up Kolb and giving up so much to get him. We missed out on a very good QB draft class as a result. Now the QB draft quality is lower, and we have no choice but to upgrade.
    We need to lock-up new leadership, before the other struggling teams make their upgrades and we’re stuck with the leftovers. Bidwell’s, please get off your hands and bring in new leadership, before it’s too late.

  95. By jocards on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    I wonder what would happen if a player…any player decided that they wouldn’t go along with the instructions of Bill Belichick or Mike Tomlin….Does anybody think that player would be playing at all the very next week? I’m betting that player would be Jerry Jones’ problem in short order. In my opinion even in this day of “look at me” and sense of entitlement you can’t allow any player to disrespect and ignore the coach. That is absolutely true no matter what you think of Whisenhunt….he is in charge after all. I just wonder what will happen when Dockett decides he doesn’t want to do something the next coach instructs.

  96. By jeffgollin on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    At all levels of the orgaization – ownership, FO, coaches and players – 58 to 0 cannot go unaddressed and words alone won’t cut it.

  97. By maham on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    Cardinals QB Draft History….


    2012 – 6TH ROUND LINDLEY
    2011 – NO QB
    2010 – 5TH ROUND SKELTON
    2009 – NO QB
    2008 – NO QB
    2007 – NO QB
    2005 – NO QB
    2004 – 7TH JOHN NAVARRE
    2003 – NO QB



  98. By maham on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply




  99. By Darren on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    thanks Darren, for ur time and effort.
    I am a season ticket holder for 13 years…next year that will start with… I was a season ticket holder

  100. By Big B on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    There comes a point in any business where success if measured by results, and when those results are not fulfilled then it is time to change direction. It is obvious that Whiz and Graves have not control of this team. The fans and the defense deserve more than what the offense is showing on Sunday’s. We need to realize we are in a rebuilding mode, Fitzgerald deserves a chance to earn a ring. I know this is not going to go along with popular opinion but my suggestion is to trade him to Minnesota for Ryan Kalil and a first round pick, he resides in Minnesota and will not be in our division for us to see him every year. This will give us a solid, young OT and an extra first round pick. The first round picks NEED to be used on a quarterback and running back and our 2nd round pick on another OT. Lets face it, Beanie is done, he is not the number one back we all hoped he would be. With a new QB, I am hopeful he can be better than what we have on our roster. I believe we have solid WR that can benefit from playing time.

  101. By T. Stone on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    Memo to Mrs. Kenneth Whisenhunt:
    Your husband will be busy in his office all day cleaning out his desk. You can really help him out by putting the house on the market and stopping buy U-Haul to get boxes.

  102. By Patrick Eagan on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    Darren, How much does Ken Whisenhunt have to do with drafting and signing the players?

  103. By Darren Urban on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    Patrick —

    RE: Whiz/draft-FA

    Whisenhunt and the coaches all take part in the draft meetings which help set the grades. As for free agency, there is major input there as well. It’s fair to say Whisenhunt has the team he wanted.

  104. By Kevin S on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    I agree with Whiz not taking the bait re: the late-game Seattle offense — the last thing you want after a shellacking is to call out the other team and make it seem like you’re not taking responsibility for your performance — but within the walls of the Cardinal locker room, that crap should provide some motivation next year when we play Seattle. Throwing deep on 4th and 23 up 51 points with 7 minutes? Throwing at all on 3rd down with under 3 minutes? Go ahead and try to justify it by saying Flynn can use the work or whatever, but this isn’t USC and that’s just a no-class move by Carroll.

  105. By Go12thmanSEA on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply


  106. By Patrick Eagan on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    Everyone on this blog is crazy if they think firing Ken Whisenhunt is the answer. If the cardinals do, they will start a whole new rebuilding process. Thats not the answer to me. The cardinals have the talent to win now. Ken Whisenhunt was so good coaching this team when he had a good QB. Example… Kurt Warner. another example…. Kevin Kolb led us to 4-0 behind terrible offensive line and no running game. Keep Kolb, find new offensive line… sign/draft another QB possibly to compete with Kolb. The cardinals need a running back thats good and healthy. The cardinals need a pass rusher. The cardinals need to stop the run. How? I am not sure. but the cardinals defense as kept us in every game this year except maybe 3. The pass defense is very good. Ray Hortons defense is just fine. Its the turnovers, lack of run game, and quaterback play that killed us.

  107. By Kevin S on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    In what has to be one of the more ironic moves of the day for Cardinals fans, the Ravens — who are 9-4 and are 9th in the league in points per game — just fired their offensive coordinator.

  108. By el on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    It all comes down to the coach he is responsible to develop these guys and inspire his team. He should have them all ready to play at game time.. He has one of the best recievers in the NFL in Fitz.. but hardly ever throws to him. Its really all very simple, you need a QB you draft one and not rely on an aging one or two who are Candian football league & not NFL QB’s at best,, Whizz had it easy when Kurt Warner was the QB but he’s gone and now he is showing his coaching ability and well 9 losses in a row and this last fiasco of getting blown away… is not going to cut it. Get a new Coach, QB, Frontline and a pass rusher.. think you will see results in a big way.

  109. By philly cards 1994- on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    @ mr egan i agree 100%

    If you’ve been a card fan for more than 10years unfortunately you’ve seen them lay down more than once in december.isn’t this the anniversary of the kc game?

    Are u playing real defense going to the training room for john skelton and whiz?
    are you risking a torn bicept for those jerks?

    This comes down to if you performed poorly at much will your boss try to rationalize your performance at 5.mill per

    Remeber tobin won 1 less game in his record breaking playoff run. The difference is ticket sales. Whiz was the last guy left and they let him run the ship into the ground.

    Whiz was able to benefit from greens work. What’s the new guys getting? He’s getting an offensive mess

    Green was fired with 1 yr left tobin got a middle finger the day before he got fired.

    Its the tickets

  110. By Cardinals902 on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    Since Kurt Warner retired, the Arizona Cardinals have played 45 games. Of those 45, only three have been victories decided by a plus 8 margin, and one (the 30-20 Max Hall win over New Orleans in 2010) was in doubt until the final minutes. So, of the last 45 games, two have been what you would call “convincing” wins – 43-13 over an awful Denver team at home in 2010, and this season’s 27-6 home win over what now looks like an equally inept Philly team.

    To me, this is a sign of a truly awful team – certainly there’s been marked improvement on defense, but at the end of the day, the Cardinals constantly relied on missed field goals, late punt returns, etc, for their victories, and all of those bounces – the things you can’t control – are now on the other side tenfold.

    Two convincing wins in 45 games, none against a team that will finish with single digit losses. You have to go back to November 8, 2009 to find the last time a Cardinals team posted a double digit road victory. I guess I don’t have a point with this, other than to say this isn’t about a sudden skid – it’s a three year pattern masked by a lot of hard fought, at times lucky, victories.

  111. By Logan cooper on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    It’s simple.
    All of this stems off of a bad offensive line that hasn’t drafted one in the top rounds since Levi brown. 49ers took three offensive linemen in the first 2 rounds a couple years ago and it is paying dividends for them.
    Until we shore up our O-line with talented young players, the woes of this team will continue.

  112. By martin on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    after the line and qb this offense needs a completely new playbook. one with some innovation and creativity. that will only come with a new head coach and coordinator to make the calls. one reason why the 9ers and c-hawks continually have gaping holes to run through and receivers wide open with the opposing defenses faked out. both their coaches seem to be very good with the x’s and o’s. seems all defenses know exactly what the cards are going to do before it happens. kelly and peterson from college ranks seem to have this going for them.

  113. By jocards on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    Darren –

    I know you can’t be absolutely certain and that you aren’t much for addressing hypothetical situations but in your opinion if a player decided that he would not go along with a directive from say coach Bill Belichick do you think he’d be playing at all the very next week? Do you think he’d even be a member of the Patriots organization for very long?

  114. By Darren Urban on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    jocards —

    RE: Belichick


  115. By CardsFan on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    How embarrassing, humiliating, and disillusioning. I feel embarrassed to be a Arizona Cardinal fan. WIsenhunt must go. I think he is too much of a player coach and that is why they do not play for them. Other than the two seasons the Cards went to the playoffs, he has losing records. We need a good quarterback, and the Cardinals franchise need to revisit their evaluation criteria for selecting a QB, because what they are using has not been working. I sold my tickets to the last two games so I will not feel any worse. The play from the Cards was pathetic with a capitol P! I do not accept Wisenhunts appology because he sounds like a broken record. I will accept his resignation. That is what we need Mr. Bidwell, we need a coach that knows how to win and how to recruit well and have the cardinals be competative year in and year out. I am down grading my ROH tickets to the 40.00 ones. The Arizona Cardinals are not worth investing a lot of money into the organization. Where the paper bag with the holes in it, I am ready to wear mine.

  116. By CardsFan on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    Oh, and whats up with Patrick Peterson laughing both times after the turn overs he created? That is the attitude that is allowed by coach Wisenhunt.

  117. By KKfan on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    Another devastating loss for the Cards yesterday. When I checked the score and saw it was 17 -0 . I thought well that isn’t too bad. They just need to regroup and they can catch up and hopefully take the lead and get the “W”.

    Than later I’m watching Sports Center on ESPN and i see the final score 58-0. I was stunned to say the least. How in the word did it get that out of hand ? Then reading the write up by Darren , I saw where Skelton had 5 turnovers …than I understood how quickly that can result in that kind of a torching. I was hoping you guys would have the kind of game that my Eagles had yesterday by pulling out a win and ending your loseing streak.

    @ kauaicard fan: Its not fair when our 3rd string offense is playing everyone’s 1st string defense!!

    I watched my Eagles play a game yesterday that had 15 rookies starting on it. To beat a playoff condenter in the Tampa Bay Bucks.

    A rookie QB only in his 4th game and 1st as the named starter for the remainder of the season. He had 381 yrds and 3 td’s and no turnovers. He shocked everyone! So it really does come down to pride when there is nothing left to play for…and their jobs.

    It wasn’t an easy win going up against the #1 defense in the NFL this season. But they hung together and they pulled off the unexpected upset.

    A teams ultimate success or failure starts with the scouting process. It appears that perhaps your scouting dept needs a house cleaning more than your coaching saff.

    Back to your comment about having to play 2nd & 3rd stringers to everyone elses starters. That goes back to your scouts and their talent evaluations and reports on players for the draft.

    As unfortunate as it is, injuries are a part of the sport. You just have to hope that the non starters can come in and take up the slack… so that theres not too much of a difference in winning and losing.

    Both our teams have had a pretty horrific season this year. But speaking for my Eagles I saw a lot yesterday out of those kids that gives me a whole of of reason to believe that the future will be a whole lot better and different next year and beyond. Hang in there its really all any of us fans can do.

  118. By jocards on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply

    Darren –

    Re: Belichick

    I completely agree and I’d go so far as to say that if it happened in Pittsburgh, S.F., STL and a myriad of other cities Dockett would at the very least be suspended….and it likely wouldn’t end there. Winning organizations simply do not tolerate their players openly dismissing a directive from the head coach. No matter what one thinks of the job that Whisenhunt has done and I have some issues in that area myself, it is difficult for me to understand how anybody could think that allowing Dockett to take the field yesterday was sending the proper message. Does it really matter who the head coach is if we’re going to allow the players to run the team and do whatever it is they wish whenever they wish to do it?

  119. By philly cards 1994- on Dec 10, 2012 | Reply


    Anyway. I think a player not listening is one thing but this isn’t the first player coach issue and I believe we have a quiet mutiny.

    I think the 7-6 was the last straw. The defense lost their will being put in that spot.

  120. By Solox on Dec 11, 2012 | Reply

    This has been brewing for years. Ever since Kurt Warner left. Even when kurt was around the O line had problems which was and still is under russ grimm. So this is not a new thing with the O line being garbage. For years grimm has not been able to square this line away. Warner always made them look better then what they were. Grimm needs to go. Matt Leinart was with cardinals for 4 seasons. When Kurt Warner retired Leinarts named as “the guy”. Then in the preseaon wiz all of a sudden figures out that Leinart is in fact not the guy and cuts him with only derek anderson max hall and john skelton on the roster. From that moment on we were doomed to failure. My question is how do you go 4 seasons with a guy, groom him to be the franchise QB then in the preseason of the season hes suppose to take over you realize hes not what your looking for? This QB situation may not rest solely on wiz but hes a big part of it. Graves needs to go as well. Hes the one allowing this nonsense to happen. We need a full house cleaning. grim, graves, wiz, OC, whoever else helps with qb scouting, skelton, lindley, kolb, wells, ryan williams, and batiste all need to go. thats all i can think of for now.

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